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1getzlaffan

Lockout 2012-13

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What does winning a cup have to do with this? In the case of the Ducks very little.

If you're running a sports league, and you want that league to represent a credible product, then a team that can outperform the rest of league, being the best product, should be successful in the league. Both the Ducks and the Kings in recent years have done this. Tampa Bay has done this. Carolina has done this. Dallas won the Cup with an asterisk. That's at least five teams that if the league contracted, the Canadian press, and the Northeast press, would say needed to be contracted. Yet the same press would say that Montreal and Toronto shouldn't be contracted.

Of course 'all' of the struggling teams would not be bought out. It would require serious studying and the cooperation of the owners. On the surface, not pointing out any particular teams if the league cut say 4 franchises, and reorganized the conferences the pool of talent would be that much more potent and the competition to make the grade that much more demanding.

I don't disagree that cutting the number of franchises would improve the talent level. I'd add that improving the rules and improving the officiating would improve the game too. The thing is, that if franchises were cut, they wouldn't cut them based on performance on the ice, or on the performance in the front office. They'd cut them because they weren't Canadian, or because the franchise wasn't close enough to NBC's and CBC's Studios (Not in the Northeast Division).

I personally wouldn't mind it. But like I said it aint gonna happen. moving teams around is going to be the first order at hand long before any fat trimming. Seattle seams ready to go, a perfect location for Phoenix. It would be a move that would make sense for Anaheim as well, but I don't see this team going anywhere.

Seattle couldn't keep the Supersonics. How are the Thunderbirds drawing? Do they sellout every game? If they can't sellout AHL hockey, is the NHL going to do any better?

Phoenix has been hit pretty hard by the recession, but it was a gamble when it was awarded, no doubt. The truth is, that the league should have had some form of revenue support for expansion teams before they created them. It's one thing to award a franchise license in essence, it's another to 'grow the sport'. Bettman used the words 'grow the sport' when he was actually just looking to essentially sell franchise licenses. That's what happened to Phoenix, that's why the NHL's now footing the bill.

I don't think it would be a terrible thing if the Phoenix franchise was contracted, but I think that the NHL has an obligation to support the franchise after selling that franchise license too. I don't know how much an improvement the franchise would see if it were in Seattle. If Phoenix is contracted, who are the other three teams that get contracted?

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Canes’ marketing has done a “fair to middling” job in selling the sport in the heart of ACC country. It helped greatly Lavi’s run/gun system helped win the Cup. After he was released and Mo’s system of dump chase hockey not only put the fans to sleep several years of missing the playoffs sealed his fate.

Their new coach brought back a more up-tempo style and with some prominent signings made the future look bright, They added a more reasonable STH pricing scheme that almost sold out the upper bowl and the upper portions of the lower bowl.

Now this, fans are ticked, The market here isn’t that great and the lack of revenue Canes games provide hurts. One great thing about the Habs and Leaf games is that these games always draw their fans,

Don’t know what a year-long lockout will do the fan base. But add another one to that lockout and the market here will diw.

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Canes’ marketing has done a “fair to middling” job in selling the sport in the heart of ACC country. It helped greatly Lavi’s run/gun system helped win the Cup. After he was released and Mo’s system of dump chase hockey not only put the fans to sleep several years of missing the playoffs sealed his fate.

Their new coach brought back a more up-tempo style and with some prominent signings made the future look bright, They added a more reasonable STH pricing scheme that almost sold out the upper bowl and the upper portions of the lower bowl.

Now this, fans are ticked, The market here isn’t that great and the lack of revenue Canes games provide hurts. One great thing about the Habs and Leaf games is that these games always draw their fans,

Don’t know what a year-long lockout will do the fan base. But add another one to that lockout and the market here will diw.

Thanks for the education on the 'Canes.

And you bring up another good point, two lockouts in ten years is probably hardest on expansion/relocation clubs. Even more reason why Bettman needs to be gone when the new CBA is created. He says 'grow the sport', and yet his long running strategy for negotiating new CBA's is to have a lockout... which severely limits the ability of the sport to grow through it's youngest franchises.

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from TSN's report today's topics for discussion is on secondary issues again such as "health and safety, medical care, drug testing, rent and mortgage reimbursements (and) grievances." Hearing things like that make it very difficult to side with the players union.

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Thanks for the education on the 'Canes.

And you bring up another good point, two lockouts in ten years is probably hardest on expansion/relocation clubs. Even more reason why Bettman needs to be gone when the new CBA is created. He says 'grow the sport', and yet his long running strategy for negotiating new CBA's is to have a lockout... which severely limits the ability of the sport to grow through it's youngest franchises.

As long as this lockout drags on and on, the sport will lose its power to grasp onto those beginning to find interest in it. They're only shooting themselves in the foot and damaging the revenue potential for expansion teams and others who have seen declines in attendance, i.e. the Ducks!

Why does this labor contract need a complete re-tooling when both sides have had plenty of time prior to the pre-season to determine contract issues? It seems to me like each side is playing a waiting game and dragging it out until one side folds on the key issues, which more than likely revolve around how the money can be equitably broken down into percentages for each side. As each day passes, those percentage points get shaved off a little more for each side and the fans become more disenchanted.

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The Ducks are scheduled to open the NHL season on 10/25 on the road at Boston on 10/25. Given this event is two weeks from tomorrow, what is the possibility this will take place as scheduled? I think the answer is clear:, not a chance.

Just wish the NHL would postpone all games until it is clear if the season is a go or no-go. If the season is to go on it needs to be decided if the existing schedule will be followed of if a revised schedule needs to be implemented

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I don't understand how we got to this point. It's Day 25 of the lockout!!! I am frustrated that both sides showed arrogance and chose not to meet earlier in the year. The lockout was inevitable. What did they think was going to happen choosing to meet during the summer for the first time?! The sport has grown beyond what anybody would have thought since the last lockout. I would never have imagined the NHL creating $3.3B in revenue when they chose to leave ESPN 8 years ago (Bravo Gary Bettman). The new rules that were implemented 8 years ago brought in new fans and tv ratings are higher than ever. How the owners and NHLPA could ignore the growth of the sport and the potential damage this might cause is incomprehensible. I usually support the Union when it comes to labor disputes, but I am disgusted at both sides on this one. Do the players not realize the increase in revenue that was brought in over the last decade? Do they not feel priviledged and lucky that the NHL has kept pace with the NBA and MLB? Do the owners not realize that this is the 3rd lockout in under 20 years? Let's get this done!!!

If I were the NHLPA, I would be happy with about 47% of the share if the league continues at the rate it does now. Over the last 8 years, revenue has risen about 5% per year. If the league continues to grow consistently, then the NHLPA would get a bigger piece of the pie in 5 years at 47% than they do now at 57%. Hell, even in 7 years they would make more at 43% than now. If I were the NHLPA and wanted progress in negotiations, I would offer 50% in Yr 1 and 2, 48% in year 3 and 4, and then 47% in years 5 and beyond. This only makes sense if revenue can grow at about 3-5% per year, and who knows the damage this lockout will have on potential increase in revenue. I understand that the owners see less of their share than the players do, since they pour so much into the business (operating expense, salaries, etc), but I think they need to accept that they will not reach the 43% figure they're looking for. Come on guys, let's meet in the middle and stop this nonsense!!! Come to an agreement for crying out loud!!!

Let's also fix revenue sharing. The Ducks, for example, are in the bottom of the league in attendance and tv ratings, yet they don't partake in revenue sharing. This only hurts franchise players like Getzlaf and Perry because their salaries will always be limited by the market they're in. If they want more money, than they'll have to find another team. I don't understand why this is such a big issue with the owners. If I were the Samuelis I would welcome a better revenue sharing system so that we can retain our franchise players.

I guess following Swiss hockey will do for now. The only positive that comes out of this for me is that NHL stars will play in Switzerland a little while longer. At least my dad will be happy to see NHL players live over there :). I am stuck here waiting for the season to start. LETS GET THIS DONE!!!

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It seems pointless to post anymore. I'm just so disgusted by this whole affair. What is wrong with at least doing a 50/50% of HRR? GET THIS DONE! IT'S NOT ONLY HURTING THE SMALL MARKETS BUT IS HURTING THE SPORT OF HOCKEY! :angry:

I can hardly bear to access the NHL site anymore. There doesn't seem to be any good news anymore! :(

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It seems pointless to post anymore. I'm just so disgusted by this whole affair. What is wrong with at least doing a 50/50% of HRR? GET THIS DONE! IT'S NOT ONLY HURTING THE SMALL MARKETS BUT IS HURTING THE SPORT OF HOCKEY! :angry:

I can hardly bear to access the NHL site anymore. There doesn't seem to be any good news anymore! :(

Agree! What a bunch of slugs. Meet a couple hours twice a week and then publicize, jeeze we're about to lose 250 million! Go figure???

The NHL is quickly becoming the NLL (Natl. Lockout League) :angry:

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What i dont get is why they didnt start talking about the new CBA a year ago? Really? You give it like a month before the current CBA expires to really start talking seriously? It is the owners fault I mean, why do the players need to take another 20% pay cut when they just took a 20% pay cut 7 years ago? Especially when the sport earned the highest amount it has earned ever last year. Bettman needs to go, he obviously doesnt really care if there is a lockout or not.

They even said it themselves, they have already lost over 230 million (dont know the exact number) dollars so far. Probably even more now that the season would of started last night. These people are willing to lose that much for preseason, when they could be losing a lot less by paying the players and getting the damn season started. This is rediculous, a 7 year old kid could get this done faster than bettman and the other goons.

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Your team has to know ASAP as to if your game on Thursday night against the Bruins in Boston on Thursday is a go or a no-go. Not all familiar with cross-country trips but would assume they would need to leave on Tuesday. Getting used to the time-change and getting a feel for the ice rink on Wednesday to prepare for the game on Thursday,

Canes are in bit better position in regards to travel is they open at home on Friday against the Rangers and have a game on Sunday against the Blue Jackets. But Semin is in Russia and Stewart is in the UK.

Just wish the league would announce that all games have been suspended until further notice. If the sides can come to an agreement, the games can proceed as scheduled, If at a certain point it becomes clear that the season needs to be cancelled so be it,

My guess is there is a vast number of season ticket holder who are mad as hell and are just waiting for an announcement from the league as to the certainty of there being a season before the ask for a refund of their ticket monies

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Why cant they just sign an agreement for 1 year and keep talking throughout the year to get one more to their liking next year without cancelling a lot of games? Instead of talking 1 month before the CBA expires and screwing everyone over.

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Why cant they just sign an agreement for 1 year and keep talking throughout the year to get one more to their liking next year without cancelling a lot of games? Instead of talking 1 month before the CBA expires and screwing everyone over.

Because they would not get a deal done, and we would be right back in the same situation this time next year. There is no incentive for the players to get a deal done if the league is running.

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Your team has to know ASAP as to if your game on Thursday night against the Bruins in Boston on Thursday is a go or a no-go. Not all familiar with cross-country trips but would assume they would need to leave on Tuesday. Getting used to the time-change and getting a feel for the ice rink on Wednesday to prepare for the game on Thursday,

Canes are in bit better position in regards to travel is they open at home on Friday against the Rangers and have a game on Sunday against the Blue Jackets. But Semin is in Russia and Stewart is in the UK.

Just wish the league would announce that all games have been suspended until further notice. If the sides can come to an agreement, the games can proceed as scheduled, If at a certain point it becomes clear that the season needs to be cancelled so be it,

My guess is there is a vast number of season ticket holder who are mad as hell and are just waiting for an announcement from the league as to the certainty of there being a season before the ask for a refund of their ticket monies

got a week ahead of myself, the deadline for your team to know for certain if the game is on should be about the middle of next week,

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Latest video update, Daly said "maybe we started talking too late". Genius....

Nobody expected negotiations to take this long. The way both the PA and owners agreed to the extension of the last CBA and how teams locked up FA's, gives me the impression that most teams are doing good. It doesn't mean I don't acknowledge struggling teams but for the most part I say the league was growing and money was flowing in.

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Nobody expected negotiations to take this long. The way both the PA and owners agreed to the extension of the last CBA and how teams locked up FA's, gives me the impression that most teams are doing good. It doesn't mean I don't acknowledge struggling teams but for the most part I say the league was growing and money was flowing in.

This is excactly what bothers me the most. I really thought they would handle this like professionals this time and do what is best for the league, the players and the fans. But now, they are stuck in a process that may well be called "half-assed approach to negotiate" and there seems to be no step forward. I remember that back in 2010, people were already concerned about Don Fehr leading the NHLPA into the negotiatons given his success rate in bringing work stoppage to pro sports. So they can´t tell me now they did not excpect this. This could have been handled a lot better and thats why people ( including me ) are starting to freak out.

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I'm becoming incredibly disillusioned with the NHL. Not sure if they'll have a fan in me when the season finally starts (this is coming from somebody thoroughly engrossed with hockey since I was a child).

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I'm becoming incredibly disillusioned with the NHL. Not sure if they'll have a fan in me when the season finally starts (this is coming from somebody thoroughly engrossed with hockey since I was a child).

II was not a hockey fan until the year the Canes won the Cup, I watched a game here and there and cheered for them in the playoffs but never went to a game. I bought a stretch run packet that year and I was hooked on GOING to the games, I did not realize the things TV cannot convey.

I am majorly disappointed on both sides of the debate, Even more so when one takes into the economy. My “family” consists of me myself and I so I get a break on going to the games. Do not understand how a family of moderate income could afford going to a game considering ticket prices and concessions prices.

The longer this goes on the fans will either increase in anger or apathy towards the situation. The Kitty-kats message board has not had a post on this topic since 9/28. If this goes on for too long, the NHL could go the way of the XFL and the USFL

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BOOO HISSS! BAH HUMBUG & ALL THAT! :angry: I'm sick to death of this lockout. :angry: These negotiations (if you can call them that) should have been ongoing during the last season. I feel bad most of all for the hockey fans. What a screw-over they have given us. :angry:

It feels good to post these angry thoughts at least once a week.! :)

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So Let get this straight...NHL has "Pulled" their 50-50 offer from the Table. What the Hell kind of move is THAT, Boneheaded and foolish let alone it is going to deepen this crisis abit.

DuckPride 4ever

MooseDuck

The NHL's offer was predicated on an 82 game season. Since that will not happen now, it's just procedure to pull the offer. Until the NHLPA understands they will not win this battle, the lockout will continue.

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Screw both sides. If we lose this season I'm going to struggle to come back.

The NFL and the NBA both had bigger differences than this, and both made deals to save their seasons.

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What i dont get is why they didnt start talking about the new CBA a year ago? Really? You give it like a month before the current CBA expires to really start talking seriously? It is the owners fault I mean, why do the players need to take another 20% pay cut when they just took a 20% pay cut 7 years ago? Especially when the sport earned the highest amount it has earned ever last year. Bettman needs to go, he obviously doesnt really care if there is a lockout or not.

They even said it themselves, they have already lost over 230 million (dont know the exact number) dollars so far. Probably even more now that the season would of started last night. These people are willing to lose that much for preseason, when they could be losing a lot less by paying the players and getting the damn season started. This is rediculous, a 7 year old kid could get this done faster than bettman and the other goons.

Part of the argument against getting into negotiations early was to see where everything stood (in terms of dollars and cents) at the end of the season and after the bulk of free agent signings. At the end of the day, these negotiations are not about rules, health, safety, etc... it's about money.

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Let's face it...Both sides are playing a game of chicken and using mind games. FOR !@#!@ Sake get a deal done.

Playing a game of chicken? Mind games?

They're way past that Moose... we're in the middle of a lockout.

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Part of the argument against getting into negotiations early was to see where everything stood (in terms of dollars and cents) at the end of the season and after the bulk of free agent signings. At the end of the day, these negotiations are not about rules, health, safety, etc... it's about money.

+1

Fehr or someone in the union mentioned that they weren't ready because they didn't have all the data (money counted) with them after Bettman announced that he was ready to negotiate for a new CBA during last season.

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