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Trouble on the horizon for RC?

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Already worried about Gibby burning out with all the action he is seeing.

Randy relied heavily on Lindholm last night he played for 30 minutes 8 seconds . How long can he keep playing those kind of minutes.

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7 hours ago, DUCKSDOC said:

Yes - No - he has said ( in the past ) that he was not interested in coaching. I don't think he has done a lot with the team over the last few years and seems to be enjoying his current life in So Cal. IMHO

He's said he wasn't interested in head coaching an NHL team.  He's been coaching in the youth league since his kids entered, and initially he was assistant-assistant coaching the defense in the NHL (though I think more as a liaison to the AHLers), then officially for the AHL team, then worked a little as a scout, and now has an open invitation to help if he wants (the team/ownership would love to have him be a part of things if he decides to ramp up his activity in the NHL). 

I think Scott wants to be as involved in the family stuff as the kids will let him, but he may change up a little once they're in college (if the college circuit or kids don't want him around).  He's seemed really happy the past few times I've met him, and I think he wants to be careful not to upset that.  That's more of an empathy thing than an explicit statement, though, and could be more a reflection of me than what's going on in his head.  I'm pretty sure he's said publicly that he feels his family made a lot of sacrifices for his career, and now it's his turn to put them first, and he enjoys doing so.  So, while I'd love for him to be more involved in the Ducks in the future, that may not be in the cards for us, or for him.

Just guessing a bit... I think the one thing that might entice him back into NHL hockey is an invite to gear up for coaching an olympic team.  He'd need to coach in the NHL before he could lead an olympic team, and I could see him wanting to do that.  He did really well developing himself within the NHL system, but I don't think he every really wanted to control the system.  

Ok, babbling.  I guess the one thing we know for sure - if he really wanted an NHL coaching career, he'd probably already be in the mix.  He's effectively been absent from the higher echelons of hockey for about a decade.

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15 minutes ago, mulcher said:

Already worried about Gibby burning out with all the action he is seeing.

Randy relied heavily on Lindholm last night he played for 30 minutes 8 seconds . How long can he keep playing those kind of minutes.

I wouldn't be all that worried about that.  Gibs isn't going to get burned out.  Mad, maybe, but not burned out.

I think what we saw last night was RC going back to RC style coaching.  All of the new plays and strategies were gone, and the TOI imbalance is back and stronger than ever.  I think the experiment with the BM plan is over, just not sure if it was really ever given a chance, and unsure whether it was torpedoed by RC, the old guard on the team, or a combination of both.

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https://www.tsn.ca/how-puck-luck-impacts-the-nhl-standings-1.1200376

^Worth the read, and really sums up the struggles of this team well. Gist of the article: We are getting puck luck and good shooting percentage, yet its having no impact because of how many shots and how much possession we are giving up.

We look and play like a lottery team except for our goaltending.

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4 minutes ago, Fisix said:

I wouldn't be all that worried about that.  Gibs isn't going to get burned out.  Mad, maybe, but not burned out.

I think what we saw last night was RC going back to RC style coaching.  All of the new plays and strategies were gone, and the TOI imbalance is back and stronger than ever.  I think the experiment with the BM plan is over, just not sure if it was really ever given a chance, and unsure whether it was torpedoed by RC, the old guard on the team, or a combination of both.

I don't know if this is true or not, would need to see it happen in multiple games. But if the bolded is true, and RC has given up on the "new style," then his firing process should be sped up. We have tried the old RC style and know what it brings...and it doesn't work in today's NHL. If RC is going to revert back to his old ways, then I don't see any point in keeping him around longer.

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2 minutes ago, BlazingEtem said:

I don't know if this is true or not, would need to see it happen in multiple games. But if the bolded is true, and RC has given up on the "new style," then his firing process should be sped up. We have tried the old RC style and know what it brings...and it doesn't work in today's NHL. If RC is going to revert back to his old ways, then I don't see any point in keeping him around longer.

Yeah, it brings us to Game 6 of the Western Conference finals. A series lost due to a bad goaltender that had to come in in relief of an injured Gibson. It brings us a regular season where we stay relevant despite having a ridiculous amount of injuries and still end up 2nd in the division.

Yes I know you mean the sweep, but you can't just ignore what happened the year before. In fairness to RC, he's had a very successful post season and a very bad post season. And 2 successful regular seasons.

We've seen what him trying a different style brings...it brings horrible possession numbers and a ridiculous shots against gap. If RC is going to revert back to his old ways I'm all for it. It's about time to try something different.

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1 hour ago, Fisix said:

I wouldn't be all that worried about that.  Gibs isn't going to get burned out.  Mad, maybe, but not burned out.

I think what we saw last night was RC going back to RC style coaching.  All of the new plays and strategies were gone, and the TOI imbalance is back and stronger than ever.  I think the experiment with the BM plan is over, just not sure if it was really ever given a chance, and unsure whether it was torpedoed by RC, the old guard on the team, or a combination of both.

I kinda thought we were still seeing players moved around in an attempt to find some unknown combination that would work. Having Sherwood start on the Kesler line was a good reward that didn't pan out. Before last night I would not have moved Aberg to the Getzalf line, and really was happy to see Henrique starting out on left wing.

This year has been crazy how we turn the puck over 5 feet from clearing our zone. We can't pass out of our zone, we can enter their zone with the puck. We can't connect 2 or 3 passes. Our defense have been caught out of position, have played the man (the wrong man on some occasions) instead of the puck on two on ones, and leave the area in front of the crease open.

All this is on top of our normal issues. Could somebody give Cogliano the widest stick blade available and force him to practice with a lacrosse ball or bouncy golf ball so he never has the puck hop his stick?

Is Fowler having a bad year because Manson is wearing the A?

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6 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

He's an option, but I haven't been overly impressed with his efforts as the Gulls head coach.  I'm not opposed to giving Eakins the rest of the season to see how it goes.  It can't be worse than Carlyle, and maybe he'll impress.  If he doesn't, we wipe the slate clean in the offseason.

Ditto. Someone is going to have to explain the fascination with Dallas Eakins as the next Ducks coach to me. I can't help but notice all of these kids who didn't develop in the AHL under Eakins (Comtois, Steel, Lundestrom, Sherwood) beating out all the Gulls players who did for roster spots with the Big Club. Not saying that Eakins is a bad coach, but wouldn't we want to see a few of his players actually stick with the big club before assuming he has the chops to coach NHL-caliber players?

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1 hour ago, dtsdlaw said:

Someone is going to have to explain the fascination with Dallas Eakins as the next Ducks coach to me.

For me, it looks like a convenient and safe move for Bob. Kinda like re-hiring Carlyle.

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53 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

Ditto. Someone is going to have to explain the fascination with Dallas Eakins as the next Ducks coach to me. I can't help but notice all of these kids who didn't develop in the AHL under Eakins (Comtois, Steel, Lundestrom, Sherwood) beating out all the Gulls players who did for roster spots with the Big Club. Not saying that Eakins is a bad coach, but wouldn't we want to see a few of his players actually stick with the big club before assuming he has the chops to coach NHL-caliber players?

And aside from player development, it's not like the team play stands to be that much better.  Maybe Eakins is forced into an organization-wide system, but he's certainly not doing anything to mitigate the shot disparity.  The Gulls are getting outshot 290 - 217 on the season.  Last year it was 2344 to 1982.  Now, the year before that, when the Gulls were good, it was better.  They actually outshot their opponents by a decent amount.  But the last season plus has been bad. 

I don't know, I'm just not all that confident he would come in and immediately revitalize the team.  There might be some improvement just from having a new voice in the room that's not Carlyle.  But I'm not optimistic he's a long-term solution.

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2 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

And aside from player development, it's not like the team play stands to be that much better.  Maybe Eakins is forced into an organization-wide system, but he's certainly not doing anything to mitigate the shot disparity.  The Gulls are getting outshot 290 - 217 on the season.  Last year it was 2344 to 1982.  Now, the year before that, when the Gulls were good, it was better.  They actually outshot their opponents by a decent amount.  But the last season plus has been bad. 

I don't know, I'm just not all that confident he would come in and immediately revitalize the team.  There might be some improvement just from having a new voice in the room that's not Carlyle.  But I'm not optimistic he's a long-term solution.

It's difficult to compare this year and the last 2. The Gulls were better because they were a pretty intact team. Last year they got depleted with so many call ups from the Ducks due to injury. The same can be said to start this year. 

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If it really comes down to looking for a new coach (which I hope) I'm kinda curious to see how Dan Bylsma would do. Sure things went south in buffalo but who knows what was going on there? He did great in Pittsburgh (having Crosby & Malkin makes the coach's job easier obviously) and he has a history with the team.

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17 hours ago, BlazingEtem said:

I don't know if this is true or not, would need to see it happen in multiple games. But if the bolded is true, and RC has given up on the "new style," then his firing process should be sped up. We have tried the old RC style and know what it brings...and it doesn't work in today's NHL. If RC is going to revert back to his old ways, then I don't see any point in keeping him around longer.

Oddly enough, it looked like we were playing new style getting creamed early on, then we switched to old and caught up.

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13 hours ago, DuckFan4Life said:

It's difficult to compare this year and the last 2. The Gulls were better because they were a pretty intact team. Last year they got depleted with so many call ups from the Ducks due to injury. The same can be said to start this year. 

I don't buy that completely.  Unless the team is completely devoid of talent, a coach has to be able to work with what he has to create a game plan that keeps his team competitive.  And the Gulls certainly had talent on the defensive side of the puck.  Maybe I'm wrong and Eakins did the best he could with what he had; I admit I'm not an expert on our AHL team.  But I think it's also telling that Eakins hasn't been strongly rumored for any coaching vacancies the past couple of offseasons.

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1 hour ago, gorbachav5 said:

I don't buy that completely.  Unless the team is completely devoid of talent, a coach has to be able to work with what he has to create a game plan that keeps his team competitive.  And the Gulls certainly had talent on the defensive side of the puck.  Maybe I'm wrong and Eakins did the best he could with what he had; I admit I'm not an expert on our AHL team.  But I think it's also telling that Eakins hasn't been strongly rumored for any coaching vacancies the past couple of offseasons.

He has.  For the Ducks.  He hasn't been rumored for any other team because he's in line for RC's job.

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2 minutes ago, Fisix said:

He has.  For the Ducks.  He hasn't been rumored for any other team because he's in line for RC's job.

Since when does "being in line" keep people from talking about you?

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Well to stick up for the coach a bit.  It's all fine and dandy to talk about the up tempo game in the NHL, but you have to have players that can play that.  I my opinion, we don't.

I think we'll see some hybrid system.  Get it out of the defensive zone asap, but with more body checking going on at both ends. 

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23 minutes ago, AyeEye said:

Well to stick up for the coach a bit.  It's all fine and dandy to talk about the up tempo game in the NHL, but you have to have players that can play that.  I my opinion, we don't.

I think we'll see some hybrid system.  Get it out of the defensive zone asap, but with more body checking going on at both ends. 

I really hope so!

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2 hours ago, Fisix said:

He has.  For the Ducks.  He hasn't been rumored for any other team because he's in line for RC's job.

I don't think that's how it works.  If you're a good coach who doesn't have an NHL job, NHL teams with openings will interview you.  And media will talk about you as being a possibility for open jobs.  Eakins has only ever been mentioned as a possibility to replace Carlyle but that doesn't preclude being available for other organizations' head coaching vacancies.

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Why are people so enamored of body checking?  It's a means to an end.  I don't care if the Ducks never body check another player as long as the team: A) Completes their passes to each other; B ) Stops the other team from getting a lot of scoring opportunities; and C) Gets a lot of their own scoring opportunities. 

I don't think this team has a body checking problem, other than maybe Fowler not clearing guys out of the crease on occasion.  This team has a defensive zone positioning problem.  They have a passing problem.  They have a zone entry problem.  They have a special teams problem.  They have a zone denial problem.  They have a forechecking problem.  Body checking isn't even on the top 10 list of things they need to do better in order to improve their play.  

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34 minutes ago, gorbachav5 said:

I don't think this team has a body checking problem, other than maybe Fowler not clearing guys out of the crease on occasion.  This team has a defensive zone positioning problem.  They have a passing problem.  They have a zone entry problem.  They have a special teams problem.  They have a zone denial problem.  They have a forechecking problem.  Body checking isn't even on the top 10 list of things they need to do better in order to improve their play.  

The physical game may not be the answer, but it might be an answer with the players we have.  If you throw the other team off their game, it could keep the contests closer while they figure out all the other issues.  We ain't going to win the speed skating contest with a Connor Mc David type, but if he's looking over his shoulder all the time, they'd stand a chance.

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22 minutes ago, AyeEye said:

The physical game may not be the answer, but it might be an answer with the players we have.  If you throw the other team off their game, it could keep the contests closer while they figure out all the other issues.  We ain't going to win the speed skating contest with a Connor Mc David type, but if he's looking over his shoulder all the time, they'd stand a chance.

It's not an answer that's in any way complete.  It will help with puck retrieval and possibly with rebound control.  But both of those are skills that are used when we don't have the puck.  From my vantage point, our biggest problem has been KEEPING the puck, or, when we don't have it, being in the right position to get it back.  Occasionally that involves throwing a body check, but more often it's just being in the right place.  

There have been a handful of times this season where I've watched a play and thought, "Man, I wish we had checked that guy better."  Conversely, there have been roughly a hundred times when I've thought, "Could we complete a pass in the defensive zone, please?" or "Could we stop a team from breaking through the neutral zone and into our zone with speed and possession of the puck?"  90% of that is a positioning problem, and I'd guess a good portion of that positioning problem is the system Carlyle is having the team play.  It's broken.

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9 minutes ago, gorbachav5 said:

It's not an answer that's in any way complete.  It will help with puck retrieval and possibly with rebound control.  But both of those are skills that are used when we don't have the puck.  From my vantage point, our biggest problem has been KEEPING the puck, or, when we don't have it, being in the right position to get it back.  Occasionally that involves throwing a body check, but more often it's just being in the right place.  

There have been a handful of times this season where I've watched a play and thought, "Man, I wish we had checked that guy better."  Conversely, there have been roughly a hundred times when I've thought, "Could we complete a pass in the defensive zone, please?" or "Could we stop a team from breaking through the neutral zone and into our zone with speed and possession of the puck?"  90% of that is a positioning problem, and I'd guess a good portion of that positioning problem is the system Carlyle is having the team play.  It's broken.

It seems like every game the opponent, regardless of who it is, dominate the game simply by holding onto to puck possession.  It seems like the Ducks are only able to enter the offensive zone with the puck and start a cycle once or twice a period. For most of the game they are scrambling around the ice chasing the puck. Their defensive system constantly breaks down as a result.

As far as the physical play goes I get the impression the Ducks players are too concerned with getting called for penalties. Not that I blame them. They been on the short end with several weak calls going against them every game. the level of scrutiny they are held to seems to be disproportionate to their opponents.

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22 minutes ago, Shadowduck said:

It seems like every game the opponent, regardless of who it is, dominate the game simply by holding onto to puck possession.  It seems like the Ducks are only able to enter the offensive zone with the puck and start a cycle once or twice a period. For most of the game they are scrambling around the ice chasing the puck. Their defensive system constantly breaks down as a result.

As far as the physical play goes I get the impression the Ducks players are too concerned with getting called for penalties. Not that I blame them. They been on the short end with several weak calls going against them every game. the level of scrutiny they are held to seems to be disproportionate to their opponents.

And rightly so - physical teams are naturally going to take more penalties since the more you hit guys, the more chances there are that you'll hit them in a bad position and get called.  Plus they're the Ducks.  

I'm not opposed to physical play if it helps accomplish the larger goals.  If it gets us the puck more often, I'm all for it.  I just don't see how physical play (other than getting body position on guys in front of the net) is going to be a huge boon to this particular team.  Maybe fans just want to see it as a proxy for giving maximum effort.  I'm all for maximum effort, but I think it would help us more in skating that extra few strides to get into better position than it would in checking.

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tell that to Pettersen after that hit by brother-of-ritchie.

hits can be an important part of the play of slow lines because it puts the opponents out of position, which opens up shooting lanes that wouldn't be there otherwise, particularly with slow or inaccurate forwards.  so, it's an important part of our play, at least with our top 2 lines (whatever that means).

the Ducks might be worried about taking penalties... but I think they're also worried about racking up injuries.

as far as Eakins - we were talking about rumors.  reporters dig for rumors about situations that their readers care about.  Eakins is pretty much a lock for RC's replacement, and I bet Eakins wants it (over other job openings) because its a continuation with some players he's developed over a few seasons, which I think is totally unlike his prior NHL experience.  anyway, there's no rumor that's interesting there, unless it's tied to RC getting the boot.  other teams don't have him in their sites because 1 - they know the Ducks have a lock, and 2 - they aren't going to be able to sell him to their ownership because of his prior NHL performance and his last 2 seasons of AHL performance (which, as we all keep saying, isn't exactly fair since most of his top players spent a LOT of time not playing for his team).

i forget, did we have a chance of bringing Tortorella here at about the same time we brought back RC?  would Kes have shot that down?

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Physical play takes a toll on other teams. Also, I personally liked our identity was a team that will hit you hard. That reputation alone will make teams nervous to play us. And we also have (had) the players to pull that off. Getzlaf, Kesler, Manson...Lindholm can too, so can Montour...Schenn. Perry when he's back. Ritchie. It was part of our identity and it's part of what sets us apart from the other teams. And we are good at it, too. Make other teams pay.

We've taken too many penalties for over 10 years now...and we've been a very successful team while doing it. Sure, how grand life would be without taking a penalty...but...we don't NEED to stop.

The thing is. We're NOT good at being a speed team. Not yet at least. I know being physical isn't the ONLY answer. A lot is going on. Passing is a big one, too. And everything else people are mentioning. But I'd rather see us do what we are good at and be good at it and compete that way than keep pushing this new system that no one is comfortable with. We're wasting a season of Gibson here.

Also, you could make the argument that being physical coudl have prevented 1 goal in each game...just allowing ONE less goal each game we could have a lot more wins right now. (i mean, I know i'm pushing it with this last point...but it could be possible!)

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Physical play is fine, so long as hitting doesn’t rule over smart hickey.  Too often I’ve seen one our guys lose focus on the puck in favor of an unnecessary hit (one that accomplishes little more than finishing the check), and The puck might have been stilen.

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4 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

This team has a defensive zone positioning problem.  They have a passing problem.  They have a zone entry problem.

Totally agree and without that your other two points end in failure. Also, our forwards are not in position in the neutral zone to accept clean passes. So I don't know what Carlyle is doing in practice but it starts in the defensive zone.

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8 hours ago, Fisix said:

He has.  For the Ducks.  He hasn't been rumored for any other team because he's in line for RC's job.

Speculation is on uptick with Ducks Promoting Wolford.

DuckPride 4ever

MooseDuck

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i'm not seeing the ducks playing as a unit right now either offensively or defensively.

hopefully this is only because of injuries,  but I'm concerned that it isn't.

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