Jump to content
The Official Site of the Anaheim Ducks
duck123

#1 Draft Pick!

Recommended Posts

6 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

I don't like Doan's suggestion for two reasons. (1) I think it will kill the trade deadline because the traditional "sellers" will hold on to their players in an attempt to get as many points as possible towards the draft. The TDL is one of my favorite hockey traditions, and I don't think tweaking the draft odds is worth ruining the TDL. (2) I think Doan's system favors better teams. The three teams closest to making the playoffs are most likely going to get the best lottery odds because those are the teams scratching and clawing to get in the tournament. Teams that are nowhere near the playoffs won't be playing with the same urgency because the players themselves don't actually give a crap where the team drafts. Every time a team takes a young player high in the draft, a current roster player is one step closer to being out of a job, so you're not going to get current veteran players to play harder just so that the team can draft someone to take their place on the roster. That said, if the league wants to insist on a weighted system for the lottery odds to create parity, I don't think it makes sense to favor teams that are right on the cusp of the playoffs already.

IMO, the only way to get rid of tanking is to give even odds to all teams that don't get in the playoffs. One ping pong ball per team, draw them one at a time in front of a live TV audience, in reverse order from #16 down to #1. I would also add a rule that no team can pick in the top-5 in consecutive drafts. With all the money flowing into the league these days, every single team should have enough to invest in their scouting departments, so let's eliminate the chances of back-to-back high lottery picks and make every team do their due diligence in scouting players.

Well, with Doan's system the teams that are truly fighting for a playoff spot are less likely to be in elimination till the last game or 2...so impossible for them to be high in the "draft standings."

But that doesn't matter 'cause I completely see your points. I do like your system! With the added rule of not being able to draft in the top 5 consecutive years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Jasoaks said:

That's what I hope the plan is, too...there seem to be some good D around those other picks we have later that it would be good to grab them, then. A goooood forward pick with our #9 just seems sooo important at this point.

Turcotte and Zegras are both committed to college so if there was any thought of them helping the Ducks next season, that idea is out the window. Dach or Couzens might drop and neither are committed to college. Only other C's in the top 20 that are not going to college are Suzuki and Lavoie.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, perry_mvp said:

Turcotte and Zegras are both committed to college so if there was any thought of them helping the Ducks next season, that idea is out the window. Dach or Couzens might drop and neither are committed to college. Only other C's in the top 20 that are not going to college are Suzuki and Lavoie.

Ohh right, right. I forgot about those commitments. I have no problem if Dach or Cozens drop lol but how long do those commitments usually last? 2 or 3 more years? Could they also just drop out? lol not that i encourage dropping out of college...buuuuut.... :P 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Jasoaks said:

Well, with Doan's system the teams that are truly fighting for a playoff spot are less likely to be in elimination till the last game or 2...so impossible for them to be high in the "draft standings."

But that doesn't matter 'cause I completely see your points. I do like your system! With the added rule of not being able to draft in the top 5 consecutive years.

Sorry, I missed that part about a team not accumulating points until mathematically eliminated. I thought it was just the last 20 games teams would accumulate points.

So since we were eliminated March 26th, we would have only have 4 games to accumulate points towards a draft pick? That doesn't seem right either. Wouldn't that system also theoretically favor teams in the better conference? It only took 90 point to get the last wild card spot in the West, whereas it took 98 points in the East, so in Doan's system a bottom feeder in the East would have been more likely to be accumulating points towards the lottery pick earlier than a team in the West since they would have been eliminated earlier.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Jasoaks said:

Ohh right, right. I forgot about those commitments. I have no problem if Dach or Cozens drop lol but how long do those commitments usually last? 2 or 3 more years? Could they also just drop out? lol not that i encourage dropping out of college...buuuuut.... :P 

It lasts as long as they want it to. Quinn Hughes went to college one year and started playing for the 'Nucks close to the end of this season. 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, dtsdlaw said:

Sorry, I missed that part about a team not accumulating points until mathematically eliminated. I thought it was just the last 20 games teams would accumulate points.

So since we were eliminated March 26th, we would have only have 4 games to accumulate points towards a draft pick? That doesn't seem right either. Wouldn't that system also theoretically favor teams in the better conference? It only took 90 point to get the last wild card spot in the West, whereas it took 98 points in the East, so in Doan's system a bottom feeder in the East would have been more likely to be accumulating points towards the lottery pick earlier than a team in the West since they would have been eliminated earlier.

Yeah, it absolutely would haha it's not great. your system seems to have some good value to it!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

IMO, the only way to get rid of tanking is to give even odds to all teams that don't get in the playoffs. One ping pong ball per team, draw them one at a time in front of a live TV audience, in reverse order from #16 down to #1. I would also add a rule that no team can pick in the top-5 in consecutive drafts. With all the money flowing into the league these days, every single team should have enough to invest in their scouting departments, so let's eliminate the chances of back-to-back high lottery picks and make every team do their due diligence in scouting players.

The NHL website (and probably elsewhere) has a 12 minute video of the ping pong ball drop which determined the draft order. The rules were explained, etc.  I acknowledge we aren't privy to each teams 4 digit combinations of #'s but I'm satisfied it's probably not rigged. I agree with you when you say "one ping pong ball per team...." but you know what will happen. If the system you suggest was implemented this year, a team like Ottawa landing at #16 or Montreal at #1 would cause a massive uproar of "unfairness" or "rigged" screams still. (Weighted ping pong balls, etc.) At least with the current system a truly bad team can't drop more than 3 positions in the draft. No matter what system is used, the powers that be are damned if they do and damned if they don't. 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

 

double post

Edited by dukitup

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, dtsdlaw said:

You're not even going to wait to see what GMBM does via trade or UFA this summer? You're just already going to declare the next several seasons a lost cause because we're picking #9?

We have assets (picks, prospects and too many wingers) and GMBM has indicated there will be significant roster changes. Can we at least wait until July 3rd or 4th to throw in the towel on 2019-20?

The Ducks could possibly be a playoff team next year depending on what Murray does this summer and how guys progress but they are still a long way from actually contending. Not to mention, Getzlaf playing at a high level. I don’t want to be like Minnesota, a playoff team but nothing else. The more we are picking outside of the lottery the less likely I see them getting back to a WCF or SCF, since guys like Getzlaf, Perry and Kesler will need to be replaced. The odds of them replacing the best center in franchise history (the biggest long-term need), a former Hart winner or Selke winner with out having a lottery pick or too-5 at worst doesn’t seem likely unless 2003 lightning strikes again.

We need pieces that are generally obtained through the draft which is why I think yesterday was a big blow to the Ducks’ future Cup hopes, not necessarily their playoff ones.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

The Ducks could possibly be a playoff team next year depending on what Murray does this summer and how guys progress but they are still a long way from actually contending. Not to mention, Getzlaf playing at a high level. I don’t want to be like Minnesota, a playoff team but nothing else. The more we are picking outside of the lottery the less likely I see them getting back to a WCF or SCF, since guys like Getzlaf, Perry and Kesler will need to be replaced. The odds of them replacing the best center in franchise history (the biggest long-term need), a former Hart winner or Selke winner with out having a lottery pick or too-5 at worst doesn’t seem likely unless 2003 lightning strikes again.

We need pieces that are generally obtained through the draft which is why I think yesterday was a big blow to the Ducks’ future Cup hopes, not necessarily their playoff ones.

I completely see your point. But I have always been a believer of if you're depending on being lucky to win...you're going to lose (more of a philosophy when gambling).

But it sort of applies here. It helps to be lucky...but being lucky isn't what's going to be getting us back to the finals. Caps were lucky with getting Ovechkin...and they JUST made it to the finals for the first time since landing him. Chicago/Pittsburgh sure, had some luck to get some high picks...but also, so did Edmonton...and look where they are. They have TWO 100 point guys and still were below us in the standings. And this was a bad year for US.

We also weren't essentially "lucky" in landing Getz/Perry. They both dropped due to their speed issues/seemingly reckless driving towards the net -- and once we landed Getz we worked as hard as we could to get Perry. That was Bryan Murray, right? Not Burke?

We were lucky in landing Kariya...only one finals appearance with him.

But anyway, I agree, we are in a difficult situation to replace 2 first-ballot hall of famers and a selke winner/multiple nominations.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, dtsdlaw said:

I don't like Doan's suggestion for two reasons. (1) I think it will kill the trade deadline because the traditional "sellers" will hold on to their players in an attempt to get as many points as possible towards the draft. The TDL is one of my favorite hockey traditions, and I don't think tweaking the draft odds is worth ruining the TDL. (2) I think Doan's system favors better teams. The three teams closest to making the playoffs are most likely going to get the best lottery odds because those are the teams scratching and clawing to get in the tournament. Teams that are nowhere near the playoffs won't be playing with the same urgency because the players themselves don't actually give a crap where the team drafts. Every time a team takes a young player high in the draft, a current roster player is one step closer to being out of a job, so you're not going to get current veteran players to play harder just so that the team can draft someone to take their place on the roster. That said, if the league wants to insist on a weighted system for the lottery odds to create parity, I don't think it makes sense to favor teams that are right on the cusp of the playoffs already.

IMO, the only way to get rid of tanking is to give even odds to all teams that don't get in the playoffs. One ping pong ball per team, draw them one at a time in front of a live TV audience, in reverse order from #16 down to #1. I would also add a rule that no team can pick in the top-5 in consecutive drafts. With all the money flowing into the league these days, every single team should have enough to invest in their scouting departments, so let's eliminate the chances of back-to-back high lottery picks and make every team do their due diligence in scouting players.

Your number 1 argument is valid, although I disagree with it.  I don't consider the trade deadline any sort of tradition worth keeping around. It's an arbitrary date so that rosters can be set a meaningful time before the playoffs. I do agree that this would decrease the sell off of assets from terrible team to good teams, but it might actually increase the number of legitimate hockey trades that are made.

Your number 2 is an incorrect assumption.  Detroit actually won the Gold Plan standings this season and they were nowhere near making the postseason.  But they continued to play hard, they didn't sell everything at the deadline, and they should be rewarded for that.  The Ducks would have gotten a better lottery seed going by this plan.  The beauty of the plan is that it is heavily biased toward bad teams (because if you're terrible, you're eliminated early and have lots of opportunities to rack up points) but it encourages teams to continue to try to win games at the end of the season.  Players get to play for something and you don't have as great a risk of a Buffalo situation.  Fans get to root for their teams to win.

I don't think the Gold Plan would completely eliminate tanking, but it would go a long way toward mitigating it and would solve a lot of the issues tanking currently causes while still helping bad teams get better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

Screw tanking.  If the Ducks hadn't blown that game to the Blues and the Kings they'd be picking third right now.  

Or if the Ducks had told their players to just stop playing hard, like I'm sure the Rangers did, maybe they could have managed to finagle themselves into just the right position to pick 2nd.

There's just no way to know how these things play out.  Hopefully they get a stud at #9.

I think if I read somewhere that if the Ducks had lost 2 more games, they would have picked 2nd.
Had they won 2 more games, they would have picked 3rd.
Of course nobody knows this in advance but interesting nonetheless.

Interesting to look at the 9th selections going back 10-15 years.
Even more interesting looking at the players left on the table and selected below the 9th pick. Most notable was in 2010 when Tarasenko went 16 and Kuznetsov went 26, just 3 picks ahead of the Ducks pick at 29, Emerson Etem.

Can you imagine Kuznetsov, The Birdman, with the Ducks? That would have been pretty cool.

 

So do your homework, boysss. Pick us a winner.

 

Edited by wataduk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. what about with playouts for the last 8 teams? the winner of this wins 5 draft places, the second 3 places.....

2. after 60 games standings (example for 10 last teams) and the team with the most points in the rest of the season wins 5 draft places, second most pointer 4 places till the last lose 5 places...

3. like some of our said, as the team is eliminated (but also would also be eliminated in the other conference), the team with the most points... so the last team is the first team which is eliminated and has more chances to win the first pick...

both without lottery... in the first the tanking problem is not solve, in the second and third the tanking should be over. and we not have this rigged lottery.

Edited by Spike1981

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, gorbachav5 said:

Your number 1 argument is valid, although I disagree with it.  I don't consider the trade deadline any sort of tradition worth keeping around. It's an arbitrary date so that rosters can be set a meaningful time before the playoffs. I do agree that this would decrease the sell off of assets from terrible team to good teams, but it might actually increase the number of legitimate hockey trades that are made.

Your number 2 is an incorrect assumption.  Detroit actually won the Gold Plan standings this season and they were nowhere near making the postseason.  But they continued to play hard, they didn't sell everything at the deadline, and they should be rewarded for that.  The Ducks would have gotten a better lottery seed going by this plan.  The beauty of the plan is that it is heavily biased toward bad teams (because if you're terrible, you're eliminated early and have lots of opportunities to rack up points) but it encourages teams to continue to try to win games at the end of the season.  Players get to play for something and you don't have as great a risk of a Buffalo situation.  Fans get to root for their teams to win.

I don't think the Gold Plan would completely eliminate tanking, but it would go a long way toward mitigating it and would solve a lot of the issues tanking currently causes while still helping bad teams get better.

I amended this in a later post because I misunderstood the part about being mathematically eliminated.

It's still  a bad idea though. With respect to Detroit, they're a perfect example of one point I raised in my subsequent post, i.e. they were mathematically eliminated earlier because the Eastern wild cards are 8 points clear of the Western wild cards, meaning that teams with fewer points in the West were still mathematically alive for longer because the conference was weaker over all. For example, the Wings were eliminated on March 12th with a record of 24-36-10 (58 points). On that same day, the Kings sat at 25-36-8 (58) points, yet the Kings weren't officially eliminated until March 19th, after playing 3 more games (all losses, btw). And by the time the Kings were eliminated, Detroit actually sat 4 points ahead of them. So I think its a dumb idea to give preference to a team just because they play in a better conference.

Also, I'll disagree with your point about the TDL lacking tradition too. It's basically an unofficial national holiday in Canada, and they;re trying to make it an official one. You may not think much of it, but it's an important part of our game. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, dtsdlaw said:

You're not even going to wait to see what GMBM does via trade or UFA this summer? You're just already going to declare the next several seasons a lost cause because we're picking #9?

We have assets (picks, prospects and too many wingers) and GMBM has indicated there will be significant roster changes. Can we at least wait until July 3rd or 4th to throw in the towel on 2019-20?

Even with no changes I don't think the current roster is bad, so long as they can stay healthy (which to be fair seems like it would take a miracle at this point). Looking at the roster for next season, say we had the following:

Jones/Getz/Kase

Rakell/Steel/Silf

Terry/Henrique/Perry

Ritchie/Rowney/Grant

Manson/Lindholm

Guhle/Fowler

Gibson

Without really knowing the third defensive pairing or backup goalie, I honestly think this roster when healthy is better than both of the wildcard teams in the West this year overall. This roster is good enough to be a playoff team when healthy IMO. That doesn't even consider young guys coming in like Comtois and Lundestrom who are close to NHL ready, as well as whatever moves Murray makes in the offseason. I expect this team to be contending for a playoff spot again next season unless Murray blows the whole thing up.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Fowl said:

They were destined for the bottom after hiring Desjardins - the Tank Commander.

Which is probably why they hired him in the first place.

Toffolli said the practices were pathetic.

Kovalchuk, their third leading scorer, was a frequent healthy scratch.
Doughty said he couldn't wait for the season to be over.
Doesn't exactly sound like a team giving their all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

The Ducks could possibly be a playoff team next year depending on what Murray does this summer and how guys progress but they are still a long way from actually contending. Not to mention, Getzlaf playing at a high level. I don’t want to be like Minnesota, a playoff team but nothing else. The more we are picking outside of the lottery the less likely I see them getting back to a WCF or SCF, since guys like Getzlaf, Perry and Kesler will need to be replaced. The odds of them replacing the best center in franchise history (the biggest long-term need), a former Hart winner or Selke winner with out having a lottery pick or too-5 at worst doesn’t seem likely unless 2003 lightning strikes again.

We need pieces that are generally obtained through the draft which is why I think yesterday was a big blow to the Ducks’ future Cup hopes, not necessarily their playoff ones.

I agree that the most pressing need for this team moving forward is replacing our #1C. Without somebody filling that role this team is never going to be a true contender.

If I'm Murray I'm making moves to try and move up to get a center like Cozens at the top of the draft. I still feel like if he's available at #4 that Colorado could be open to a deal. They have their top forwards to build around, they might be willing to trade the #4 for the #9 and #20 picks and a roster player, as that would give them more depth players to place around their core guys. 

Or what about making a deal with Tampa for the rights to Point? Tampa will be hard up against the cap next season, they likely only have 1 pick in the top 80 picks this season which will probably be around the 30th overall. Also Point is legit and could be our top line C answer. Perhaps they would be open to moving him for the #9 pick + something else? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

The Ducks could possibly be a playoff team next year depending on what Murray does this summer and how guys progress but they are still a long way from actually contending. Not to mention, Getzlaf playing at a high level. I don’t want to be like Minnesota, a playoff team but nothing else. The more we are picking outside of the lottery the less likely I see them getting back to a WCF or SCF, since guys like Getzlaf, Perry and Kesler will need to be replaced. The odds of them replacing the best center in franchise history (the biggest long-term need), a former Hart winner or Selke winner with out having a lottery pick or too-5 at worst doesn’t seem likely unless 2003 lightning strikes again.

We need pieces that are generally obtained through the draft which is why I think yesterday was a big blow to the Ducks’ future Cup hopes, not necessarily their playoff ones.

I agree that you need great players, but I also maintain there are other ways to obtain them other than to draft them into your own organization with top-5 picks. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the only players on our 2007 Cup team that we drafted into the organization were Getzlaf, Perry, Bryz, and Drew Miller, and none of those were high drafts picks.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

I agree that you need great players, but I also maintain there are other ways to obtain them other than to draft them into your own organization with top-5 picks. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the only players on our 2007 Cup team that we drafted into the organization were Getzlaf, Perry, Bryz, and Drew Miller, and none of those were high drafts picks.

Boy, I remember that Getzlaf/Perry draft like it was yesterday.
Driving in my car and Lee Hacksaw Hamilton came on the Mighty 690 radio station gushing about those 2 guys.


You are absolutely right though...outside of the first 2-3 selections, you need great scouting mixed with good luck.
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

I amended this in a later post because I misunderstood the part about being mathematically eliminated.

It's still  a bad idea though. With respect to Detroit, they're a perfect example of one point I raised in my subsequent post, i.e. they were mathematically eliminated earlier because the Eastern wild cards are 8 points clear of the Western wild cards, meaning that teams with fewer points in the West were still mathematically alive for longer because the conference was weaker over all. For example, the Wings were eliminated on March 12th with a record of 24-36-10 (58 points). On that same day, the Kings sat at 25-36-8 (58) points, yet the Kings weren't officially eliminated until March 19th, after playing 3 more games (all losses, btw). And by the time the Kings were eliminated, Detroit actually sat 4 points ahead of them. So I think its a dumb idea to give preference to a team just because they play in a better conference.

Also, I'll disagree with your point about the TDL lacking tradition too. It's basically an unofficial national holiday in Canada, and they;re trying to make it an official one. You may not think much of it, but it's an important part of our game. 

 

If we award playoff spots based on conference strength, I don't see any reason to do differently for the draft.  The point is that even after a team has nothing to play for, they continue to try to win.  And it has the side benefit that it will be generally true that if you are eliminated earlier, your conference is stronger and you need the help more in order to get back into playoff contention.  It's not perfect, but it works and I love the idea that fans get to root for their teams to win at the end of the season.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Jasoaks said:

I can't argue with that. But that doesn't prove anything. I still don't think it's rigged.

No, it's not rigged. It is however, a strange coincidence that both of the largest TV revenue markets got a nice boost in draft position.

There are representatives from each team in the room for the ping pong ball festivities.
Henry Samueli was our rep this year.
What I don't get is...if they already know the order...do the team GM's and executives on stage for the card flipping already know the results as well?  Or, are the ping pong ball team reps sworn to secrecy?

Edited by wataduk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, wataduk said:

No, it's not rigged. It is however, a strange coincidence that both of the largest TV revenue markets got a nice boost in draft position.

There are representatives from each team in the room for the ping pong ball festivities.
Henry Samueli was our rep this year.
What I don't get is...if they already know the order...do the team GM's and executives on stage for the card flipping already know the results as well?  Or, are the ping pong ball team reps sworn to secrecy?

If they know they why didn't Luc Robitaille storm out and refuse to be on TV. Lol

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jasoaks said:

I completely see your point. But I have always been a believer of if you're depending on being lucky to win...you're going to lose (more of a philosophy when gambling).

But it sort of applies here. It helps to be lucky...but being lucky isn't what's going to be getting us back to the finals. Caps were lucky with getting Ovechkin...and they JUST made it to the finals for the first time since landing him. Chicago/Pittsburgh sure, had some luck to get some high picks...but also, so did Edmonton...and look where they are. They have TWO 100 point guys and still were below us in the standings. And this was a bad year for US.

We also weren't essentially "lucky" in landing Getz/Perry. They both dropped due to their speed issues/seemingly reckless driving towards the net -- and once we landed Getz we worked as hard as we could to get Perry. That was Bryan Murray, right? Not Burke?

We were lucky in landing Kariya...only one finals appearance with him.

But anyway, I agree, we are in a difficult situation to replace 2 first-ballot hall of famers and a selke winner/multiple nominations.

Edmonton not making the playoffs with two 100 point players shows how awful their management has been. They have had the talent and assets to contend but threw them away while saddling themselves with bad contracts. You need to lucky at the end of the day, and being bad helps improve your odds.

37 minutes ago, nieder said:

Even with no changes I don't think the current roster is bad, so long as they can stay healthy (which to be fair seems like it would take a miracle at this point). Looking at the roster for next season, say we had the following:

Jones/Getz/Kase

Rakell/Steel/Silf

Terry/Henrique/Perry

Ritchie/Rowney/Grant

Manson/Lindholm

Guhle/Fowler

Gibson

Without really knowing the third defensive pairing or backup goalie, I honestly think this roster when healthy is better than both of the wildcard teams in the West this year overall. This roster is good enough to be a playoff team when healthy IMO. That doesn't even consider young guys coming in like Comtois and Lundestrom who are close to NHL ready, as well as whatever moves Murray makes in the offseason. I expect this team to be contending for a playoff spot again next season unless Murray blows the whole thing up.

It’s not a bad roster by any means, especially when you have Gibson in net. I don’t think it’s a playoff roster but Murray is going to make moves this offseason that could get them there. It is absolutely not a contending roster. I think Comtois and Lundestrom are likely to start in SD to get their feet wet like, which is fine and there is no need to rush them into the lineup unless injuries are an issue.

19 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

I agree that you need great players, but I also maintain there are other ways to obtain them other than to draft them into your own organization with top-5 picks. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the only players on our 2007 Cup team that we drafted into the organization were Getzlaf, Perry, Bryz, and Drew Miller, and none of those were high drafts picks.

The 2007 Cup team hit multiple jackpots in the 2003 draft, which if it weren’t the best draft in NHL history. I’d doubt guys like Getzlaf and Perry slide back enough for us to select them. Or, we just hit a once in a lifetime draft that won’t be duplicated lol.

We also lucked out that one of the best defensemen ever wanted to play with his brother, who was a Duck. Also, that Chris Pronger forced a trade off a team that went to game 7 of the SCF the previous season, which had beaten us in the process. Without any of these things happening, the Ducks don’t win the Cup.

If we can bring in a elite piece outside of the draft then I’m all for looking at it, but am not seeing many options since it’s hard and rare to pull those moves off. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've never followed the draft closely. Anybody know whether this draft class is highly regarded? I know Hughes and Kaakko are supposed to be the next big thing but is it a crapshoot from then on? The draft is always kind of a crapshoot but you know. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, gorbachav5 said:

If we award playoff spots based on conference strength, I don't see any reason to do differently for the draft.  The point is that even after a team has nothing to play for, they continue to try to win.  And it has the side benefit that it will be generally true that if you are eliminated earlier, your conference is stronger and you need the help more in order to get back into playoff contention.  It's not perfect, but it works and I love the idea that fans get to root for their teams to win at the end of the season.

I still think the bolded ignores the fact that the players DON'T CARE where the team drafts. They're not going to magically try harder for better odds at a higher draft pick, just so that some younger, cheaper player can eventually take their job. As much as some fans want to believe they do, players don't go into the tank near the end of the season because of the draft. They go in the tank because they develop bad attitudes and bad work ethics and stop caring about winning and losing. It's a fantasy to think that the Sabres or Kings would have turned it around over the last 2-3 weeks if only they were playing for higher lottery odds, just as it's a fantasy to think that they intentionally lost games this season to improve their chances of drafting Hughes or Kakko.  

For the second bolded, it only means that your 7/8 seeds are stronger than the other conference's 7/8 seeds, not that the conference as a whole is stronger. Also, teams play against their division/conference rivals for the chance to play for the Stanley Cup. The draft is a league-wide thing. It's apples and oranges. I don't see how they compare.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, DucksFan_08 said:

I've never followed the draft closely. Anybody know whether this draft class is highly regarded? I know Hughes and Kaakko are supposed to be the next big thing but is it a crapshoot from then on? The draft is always kind of a crapshoot but you know. 

Hughes and Kakko are really good, Cozens and Dach are slightly below them, then the next 6-7 picks should all be pretty decent and largely interchangeable IMO. After the 10th pick I think there's a bit of a drop off. Anaheim should be able to get somebody decent at #9.

There are a few diamonds in the rough further down though I think. If Anaheim is picking around #20 I would take a serious look at Matthew Robertson. I know, another LHD, but he's a big boy, plays physical and plays in every situation. Hunter Jones and Mads Sogaard are the 2 top goalies available in the CHL and they are both good prospects. Sogaard is huge (6'7") and his stock likely dropped after he and Denmark played poorly at the World Juniors but both could go in the second round and both could end up being steals much like Gibson. Brett Leason should go late in the first round as he only really emerged this season but he led Prince Albert in scoring this season. He could be a steal late in the first round. So I don't think its an overly deep draft but there are some nice pieces to be had.

Edited by nieder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

Edmonton not making the playoffs with two 100 point players shows how awful their management has been. They have had the talent and assets to contend but threw them away while saddling themselves with bad contracts. You need to lucky at the end of the day, and being bad helps improve your odds.

It’s not a bad roster by any means, especially when you have Gibson in net. I don’t think it’s a playoff roster but Murray is going to make moves this offseason that could get them there. It is absolutely not a contending roster. I think Comtois and Lundestrom are likely to start in SD to get their feet wet like, which is fine and there is no need to rush them into the lineup unless injuries are an issue.

The 2007 Cup team hit multiple jackpots in the 2003 draft, which if it weren’t the best draft in NHL history. I’d doubt guys like Getzlaf and Perry slide back enough for us to select them. Or, we just hit a once in a lifetime draft that won’t be duplicated lol.

We also lucked out that one of the best defensemen ever wanted to play with his brother, who was a Duck. Also, that Chris Pronger forced a trade off a team that went to game 7 of the SCF the previous season, which had beaten us in the process. Without any of these things happening, the Ducks don’t win the Cup.

If we can bring in a elite piece outside of the draft then I’m all for looking at it, but am not seeing many options since it’s hard and rare to pull those moves off. 

Where you see luck, I see people being opportunistic. While they all seem like "no-brainers"...and they really are...it still took an effort and probably a bigger one than originally hoping for....except for Scotty....that one may have been a pretty easy decision and an easy thing to pull off lol unnnleeeessss that's secretly why we got Rob in the first place.... ;)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

I still think the bolded ignores the fact that the players DON'T CARE where the team drafts. They're not going to magically try harder for better odds at a higher draft pick, just so that some younger, cheaper player can eventually take their job. As much as some fans want to believe they do, players don't go into the tank near the end of the season because of the draft. They go in the tank because they develop bad attitudes and bad work ethics and stop caring about winning and losing. It's a fantasy to think that the Sabres or Kings would have turned it around over the last 2-3 weeks if only they were playing for higher lottery odds, just as it's a fantasy to think that they intentionally lost games this season to improve their chances of drafting Hughes or Kakko.  

For the second bolded, it only means that your 7/8 seeds are stronger than the other conference's 7/8 seeds, not that the conference as a whole is stronger. Also, teams play against their division/conference rivals for the chance to play for the Stanley Cup. The draft is a league-wide thing. It's apples and oranges. I don't see how they compare.  

 

It doesn't at all.  I'm talking about the organization, i.e. "the team."  If you've seen any of my posts here over the last couple of months, you know that I agree the players will still play hard.  The team should strive to continue to win and the fans should be given something they can cheer for, not this garbage we have now where every win sends fans to message boards to complain about how bad their team is at losing on purpose.  It's terrible.

It's not different at all.  Some teams make the playoffs because their conference is weaker.  Why would it be inconsistent if the draft carried some of those same implications?  I don't see a problem with it.

  • Thanks 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, gorbachav5 said:

It doesn't at all.  I'm talking about the organization, i.e. "the team."  If you've seen any of my posts here over the last couple of months, you know that I agree the players will still play hard.  The team should strive to continue to win and the fans should be given something they can cheer for, not this garbage we have now where every win sends fans to message boards to complain about how bad their team is at losing on purpose.  It's terrible.

It's not different at all.  Some teams make the playoffs because their conference is weaker.  Why would it be inconsistent if the draft carried some of those same implications?  I don't see a problem with it.

Ah, well then, if it's about ending the complaining by tankers every time our team wins a game, count me in!

Although I still prefer the idea of one ping pong ball per team, no weighted odds either way. Then we can just discuss how the team is playing in the GDTs without bringing up the draft at all.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...