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Sexlaf15

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3 minutes ago, dukitup said:

His long time GF is now working for ESPN on the East Coast. Murray really needs to have a chat with him to see where his head is at. Maybe playing closer to her is more important than signing an extension with Anaheim. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Lindholm traded instead of Manson if a top 4D is moved. 

Interesting. That is a concern. If the team still isn't competitive by next summer then there would be a higher risk of him wanting to test the UFA market in 2022, so it may be the prudent move to trade him either at this year's deadline or at next summer's draft. I still think he's our best D-man, but if there's a high risk of losing him for nothing to UFA, then a good GM has to make that move.

I also agree with others about trading Manson. I'd rather move him while his value is high and re-sign Guddy after the ED as a stop-gap. Manson has not played well the past two seasons and he doesn't seem to fit with anyone beside Lindholm. So if Lindholm gets moved, why keep Manson? Especially if he can get a good piece in a trade.

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9 hours ago, Sexlaf15 said:

I’m not nearly as high on Thrun or LaCombe. I just personally think that nothing you get back really gives you the same value as your your 2 best defensemen. 
Fowler’s contract reduces his value too much for me. And I’ll die on the Fowler is the Ducks MVP, they simply are way worse without him on the team. 
You’re right that Lindholm is valuable, but he’s still not that old, he’s your best shutdown defensemen, and you don’t really have anyone that replaces him. Ducks are getting a lot of Cap in the next couple years, I think you’ll need Lindholm/Fowler to anchor your blue line 

Partnering Lindholm or Fowler with Drysdale makes me very excited. Add Moore maybe becoming a top 4, 

Fowler - Drysdale 

Lindholm - Moore 

This is also under the impression Manson leaves, if he stays the Ducks blue line looks very good again. Also reduces the pressure on Moore and Nickl. 

Yeah, I think it’s also just the nature of a rebuild in that you have to give up some decent or good players, that you likely aren’t able to immediately replace, for future assets or other needs. The Ducks aren’t going to be contending anytime soon and have major decisions to make on UFA’s within two years. They have a very good chance of being in position to draft a high end Lindholm/Fowler replacement type next year so the timing may work out. LA traded Muzzin and Martinez (cup winners) to help with their rebuild and I think are considerably ahead in their rebuild than us even though we both have missed the playoffs the last two seasons. I’m really skeptical of having early to mid 30’s Lindholm and Fowler being anchors on a contending defense.

12 minutes ago, Jasoaks said:

Yeah, I kinda get a sense this is more likely, too. Lindholm should get us some goooood return, though. At this point....what do we need? You could argue we need everything except goaltending still? Do we still need a "goal-scorer" finisher? Or should we be content with seeing how our prospects work out right now?

Is Nylander still a worthy player to go after?

Aside from goaltending, we still need everything but scoring is still the biggest concern. Another high end center is desperately needed. Since the prospects will determine the future, I think we have to wait to see how they start panning out.

7 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

Interesting. That is a concern. If the team still isn't competitive by next summer then there would be a higher risk of him wanting to test the UFA market in 2022, so it may be the prudent move to trade him either at this year's deadline or at next summer's draft. I still think he's our best D-man, but if there's a high risk of losing him for nothing to UFA, then a good GM has to make that move.

I also agree with others about trading Manson. I'd rather move him while his value is high and re-sign Guddy after the ED as a stop-gap. Manson has not played well the past two seasons and he doesn't seem to fit with anyone beside Lindholm. So if Lindholm gets moved, why keep Manson? Especially if he can get a good piece in a trade.

Agreed and I don’t see how the Ducks are competitive by next summer, but then again I’m cautiously pessimistic.

Also, your guy Wenneberg is getting bought out by Columbus! 

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3 minutes ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

Yeah, I think it’s also just the nature of a rebuild in that you have to give up some decent or good players, that you likely aren’t able to immediately replace, for future assets or other needs. The Ducks aren’t going to be contending anytime soon and have major decisions to make on UFA’s within two years. They have a very good chance of being in position to draft a high end Lindholm/Fowler replacement type next year so the timing may work out. LA traded Muzzin and Martinez (cup winners) to help with their rebuild and I think are considerably ahead in their rebuild than us even though we both have missed the playoffs the last two seasons. I’m really skeptical of having early to mid 30’s Lindholm and Fowler being anchors on a contending defense.

Aside from goaltending, we still need everything but scoring is still the biggest concern. Another high end center is desperately needed. Since the prospects will determine the future, I think we have to wait to see how they start panning out.

Agreed and I don’t see how the Ducks are competitive by next summer, but then again I’m cautiously pessimistic.

Also, your guy Wenneberg is getting bought out by Columbus! 

Saw that. Portzline also tweeted this about him: "One last note: Alexander Wennberg was always patient and generous with his time, a true gentleman, even as the questions became more repetitive and difficult to answer in the last few seasons. Always got the sense that every player in the #CBJ dressing room was rooting for him." Sounds like a great locker room guy. It's too bad GMBM overvalues his own draftees, because Wennberg would be a tremendous add as a middle-6 center. His offensive game has been muzzled by Torts (gee, where have we seen that before coughwildbillcough), but I really think he can still play at a high level in the right situation. I'd love to see GMBM sign him on a cheap redemption contract so we could drop him between Rakell and Silf for an all-Swede line.

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39 minutes ago, gotchabari said:

I hope the timing works out where, at least for one season, Getzy is still slick with his passing vision while he has a matured Perrault to pass to.

Maybe it happens where Perrault's first season and Getzy's last has them as a 2nd or 3rd line pairing.

I am hoping Getzlaf can have a Thornton-esque finish to his career.  He can slowly move down the lineup and remain a passing wizard, setting up teammates even while his goal-scoring and skating fade.  Thornton put up 82 points at age 36, and has been above a .6 PPG pace every year until he turned 40 last year.  Getz might not quite reach that level, but he could do something similar.

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3 minutes ago, gorbachav5 said:

I am hoping Getzlaf can have a Thornton-esque finish to his career.  He can slowly move down the lineup and remain a passing wizard, setting up teammates even while his goal-scoring and skating fade.  Thornton put up 82 points at age 36, and has been above a .6 PPG pace every year until he turned 40 last year.  Getz might not quite reach that level, but he could do something similar.

GMBM will need to surround Getzlaf with more talent if that is going to happen. Thornton has benefitted greatly from having highly skilled teammates who can actually score goals when he passes to them. 

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28 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

Saw that. Portzline also tweeted this about him: "One last note: Alexander Wennberg was always patient and generous with his time, a true gentleman, even as the questions became more repetitive and difficult to answer in the last few seasons. Always got the sense that every player in the #CBJ dressing room was rooting for him." Sounds like a great locker room guy. It's too bad GMBM overvalues his own draftees, because Wennberg would be a tremendous add as a middle-6 center. His offensive game has been muzzled by Torts (gee, where have we seen that before coughwildbillcough), but I really think he can still play at a high level in the right situation. I'd love to see GMBM sign him on a cheap redemption contract so we could drop him between Rakell and Silf for an all-Swede line.

I like the idea of adding a guy like him to take the burden off Zegras as he develops with Getzlaf not too far away from retiring. I think a team like Winnipeg is already blowing up his agents’ phone.

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We need to remember that Drysdale and Moore are both 18.  I see lots of chatter about trading and slotting in, but we need to align that with the contract expirations of Lindy and Manson happening in 2022.

Drysdale may be able to come in faster than Moore, but we don't want to Fowler them, either.  

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17 minutes ago, gotchabari said:

We need to remember that Drysdale and Moore are both 18.  I see lots of chatter about trading and slotting in, but we need to align that with the contract expirations of Lindy and Manson happening in 2022.

Drysdale may be able to come in faster than Moore, but we don't want to Fowler them, either.  

Exxxaaaccctttllllly. We need Drysdale to develop well...I don't know how to do that. And I'm still not confident the ducks management also knows how to do that lol

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18 minutes ago, gotchabari said:

We need to remember that Drysdale and Moore are both 18.  I see lots of chatter about trading and slotting in, but we need to align that with the contract expirations of Lindy and Manson happening in 2022.

Drysdale may be able to come in faster than Moore, but we don't want to Fowler them, either.  

Definitely, which is why I don’t want to move Lindholm or Fowler. I think they’re both more important than Manson, and I won’t hate keeping him, just feel that Manson is a bit more expendable. My predictions were about 3 years down the line personally. 

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16 minutes ago, gotchabari said:

We need to remember that Drysdale and Moore are both 18.  I see lots of chatter about trading and slotting in, but we need to align that with the contract expirations of Lindy and Manson happening in 2022.

Drysdale may be able to come in faster than Moore, but we don't want to Fowler them, either.  

So true.

The current pandemic may also impact their timeline. These kids need to play as much as possible if they want to develop into competent NHL D-men, and sitting at home on Zoom calls with their trainers and coaches isn't going to get them to the Big Club any faster.. 

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1 minute ago, Jasoaks said:

Exxxaaaccctttllllly. We need Drysdale to develop well...I don't know how to do that. And I'm still not confident the ducks management also knows how to do that lol

We don’t have Randy Carlyle getting his grubby mitts on Drysdale like he did Fowler. Not a coincidence Fowler had probably his best season of his career analytically last year. 

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2 hours ago, dtsdlaw said:

GMBM will need to surround Getzlaf with more talent if that is going to happen. Thornton has benefitted greatly from having highly skilled teammates who can actually score goals when he passes to them. 

Absolutely, but I'm referring more to the maintenance of his skill than the actual production.  Getzlaf's numbers were way down last year partially because of age but mostly because his linemates couldn't find the back of the net with a map and a compass.  If Getzlaf is committed to staying, hopefully we can get him some good linemates by the year after next and he can continue to be a valuable asset to the team.

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17 minutes ago, gorbachav5 said:

Absolutely, but I'm referring more to the maintenance of his skill than the actual production.  Getzlaf's numbers were way down last year partially because of age but mostly because his linemates couldn't find the back of the net with a map and a compass.  If Getzlaf is committed to staying, hopefully we can get him some good linemates by the year after next and he can continue to be a valuable asset to the team.

I don’t really see his skill degrading. I don’t think he played any worse than he has, but your right, his wingers couldn’t score to save their lives. I think Getzlaf can easily be a 60+pt guy, just needs some dudes to score. 

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6 hours ago, Sexlaf15 said:

I don’t really see his skill degrading. I don’t think he played any worse than he has, but your right, his wingers couldn’t score to save their lives. I think Getzlaf can easily be a 60+pt guy, just needs some dudes to score. 

he definitely played worse, the question was whether it was motivation related or age/eyesight(injury) related.  it seemed motivation related, but you never know.

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3 hours ago, Sexlaf15 said:

This draft could be an very important turning point for the franchise. 

Agreed. Still think that they need more top-end prospects but they did a solid job and better than last year. San Jose being ranked so highly is surprising but two more drafts like this past one and I think that the Ducks are back in business. Getting a premium center, especially if Zegras goes to the wing and stays there, is going to be crucial going forward.

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4 hours ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

Agreed. Still think that they need more top-end prospects but they did a solid job and better than last year. San Jose being ranked so highly is surprising but two more drafts like this past one and I think that the Ducks are back in business. Getting a premium center, especially if Zegras goes to the wing and stays there, is going to be crucial going forward.

Why would Zegras go to the wing?  Has there been anything from the organization about doing that?  Because that would be dumb.

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10 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

Why would Zegras go to the wing?  Has there been anything from the organization about doing that?  Because that would be dumb.

During the hot stove talk with Hayward I’m pretty sure Murray said that they will start Zegras at the wing mostly to break him into the league. Whether he gets Rakell’d or Terry’d is a different story. 

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45 minutes ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

During the hot stove talk with Hayward I’m pretty sure Murray said that they will start Zegras at the wing mostly to break him into the league. Whether he gets Rakell’d or Terry’d is a different story. 

hmmm...really not sure how much I like that...seems like a misstep in his development to me.... but I dunno! I know Getzlaf broke in as a winger and then pretty quickly went to center. I just get really worried with how we develop players lol Like, if he wants to be center. Is already very good at center. And we need a top center. Why spend ANY time with him somewhere else?

Also, Terry should be center. It's still mind blowing that they haven't put him there, to me.

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1 hour ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

During the hot stove talk with Hayward I’m pretty sure Murray said that they will start Zegras at the wing mostly to break him into the league. Whether he gets Rakell’d or Terry’d is a different story. 

I don't think that makes sense in the long run, but if it's simply to get him in the lineup sooner, I'm okay with that.  Moving Rakell to the wing was the right move, although Rakell is much more of a shooter than a playmaker.  Keeping a playmaker like Zegras on the wing seems like a waste to me.  I'd rather see Henrique move over.  

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1 hour ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

During the hot stove talk with Hayward I’m pretty sure Murray said that they will start Zegras at the wing mostly to break him into the league. Whether he gets Rakell’d or Terry’d is a different story. 

It's not uncommon to start centers on the wing so that they can get used to NHL speed without having to worry about the defensive responsibilities.

Long-term I think they would expect him to be a center.

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2 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

I don't think that makes sense in the long run, but if it's simply to get him in the lineup sooner, I'm okay with that.  Moving Rakell to the wing was the right move, although Rakell is much more of a shooter than a playmaker.  Keeping a playmaker like Zegras on the wing seems like a waste to me.  I'd rather see Henrique move over.  

I think that’s the goal, but there’s currently no room for Zegras at any position. Given Murray’s history and not much faith in development, I can’t rule it out lol.

2 hours ago, nieder said:

It's not uncommon to start centers on the wing so that they can get used to NHL speed without having to worry about the defensive responsibilities.

Long-term I think they would expect him to be a center.

I think that’s the expectation also. Unless he’s Patrick Kane on the wing. Long term I still think they need another top flight center in the system if they want to be able to compete with the likes of LA. 
 

Also, the Blackhawks reportedly told fans that they are rebuilding their roster. Can’t wait to see that unfold!

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1 hour ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

I think that’s the goal, but there’s currently no room for Zegras at any position. Given Murray’s history and not much faith in development, I can’t rule it out lol.

I think that’s the expectation also. Unless he’s Patrick Kane on the wing. Long term I still think they need another top flight center in the system if they want to be able to compete with the likes of LA. 
 

Also, the Blackhawks reportedly told fans that they are rebuilding their roster. Can’t wait to see that unfold!

There's always room if he's playing up to his potential.  Jones and Comtois can still be sent down.  Personally, I'd put Zegras at center and put Henrique on his wing.  Henrique can help him get acclimated at the NHL level, and it puts both at a more natural position.

  • Milano - Getzlaf - Rakell
  • Henrique - Zegras - Silf
  • Heinen/Comtois/Jones - Steel - Terry
  • 4th line

But who knows?  If Murray is keeping his promise to Shattenkirk and actually going for the playoffs, that lineup isn't going to cut it and we should see a trade.  We'll see.

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2 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

There's always room if he's playing up to his potential.  Jones and Comtois can still be sent down.  Personally, I'd put Zegras at center and put Henrique on his wing.  Henrique can help him get acclimated at the NHL level, and it puts both at a more natural position.

  • Milano - Getzlaf - Rakell
  • Henrique - Zegras - Silf
  • Heinen/Comtois/Jones - Steel - Terry
  • 4th line

But who knows?  If Murray is keeping his promise to Shattenkirk and actually going for the playoffs, that lineup isn't going to cut it and we should see a trade.  We'll see.

Yeah, if Zegras is too undeniably good then keep him up but anything short of that, then I’d rather him be in San Diego. 

Murray’s comments of trying to push for the playoffs seem more insane to me after a better Blackhawks team, that made the playoffs, came out and said they are going to rebuild. You’re right with the wait and see because I’m exhausted with trying to figure out what Murray’s going to do.

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5 minutes ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

Yeah, if Zegras is too undeniably good then keep him up but anything short of that, then I’d rather him be in San Diego. 

Murray’s comments of trying to push for the playoffs seem more insane to me after a better Blackhawks team, that made the playoffs, came out and said they are going to rebuild. You’re right with the wait and see because I’m exhausted with trying to figure out what Murray’s going to do.

I've made peace with the fact that Murray's no longer a good GM (some might argue he never was).  I don't like it, but I've accepted it.  A rebuild is not happening, at least not in the way rebuilds usually happen.  So I might as well root for the team to be as interesting as possible.  Perhaps that involves a trade.  I'm pretty sure it involves Zegras being on the big club, even though I know that might be detrimental in the long term.  I've also completely lost faith in the Murray regime being able to develop players, so I don't know that keeping Zegras down will really help either.

My speculation is that Murray has a mandate to improve.  I think he and Eakins both have two years left on their respective deals, so my hope is this: if the team fails to make the postseason, Murray gets shown the door, along with Dallas.  If the team does make the postseason, well, then we get to watch at least a little bit of playoff hockey ahead of schedule.  The worst case scenario is that the team sucks and Murray gets to keep his job.  Which is certainly plausible, but I'm hopeful.

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3 hours ago, gorbachav5 said:

I've made peace with the fact that Murray's no longer a good GM (some might argue he never was).  I don't like it, but I've accepted it.  A rebuild is not happening, at least not in the way rebuilds usually happen.  So I might as well root for the team to be as interesting as possible.  Perhaps that involves a trade.  I'm pretty sure it involves Zegras being on the big club, even though I know that might be detrimental in the long term.  I've also completely lost faith in the Murray regime being able to develop players, so I don't know that keeping Zegras down will really help either.

My speculation is that Murray has a mandate to improve.  I think he and Eakins both have two years left on their respective deals, so my hope is this: if the team fails to make the postseason, Murray gets shown the door, along with Dallas.  If the team does make the postseason, well, then we get to watch at least a little bit of playoff hockey ahead of schedule.  The worst case scenario is that the team sucks and Murray gets to keep his job.  Which is certainly plausible, but I'm hopeful.

If Murray is under a mandate to make a playoff push from ownership then I blame ownership for being short-sided. Either way, I think that we are going to be in for a couple more seasons of missing the playoffs regardless, so any attempt to juice this team to a first round exit next season is just delaying the inevitable. Which is a rebuild lol. I think you either need give Murray the leeway to do a rebuild or fire him and bring in someone else to do it. Until the last couple of seasons, I think Murray was a suitable GM but he's never had to re-build a team and judging by his comments, he doesn't really want to.

Murray has two more years left on his deal and if the expansion draft weren't coming up, I think he'd be gone if the Ducks don't make the playoffs this season. Plus, I don't think that the Samueli's are going to want to pay for two GM's or two coaches. Things would have to really go off the rails for that to happen, IMO. In two years, I'm betting on the Ducks having a new GM and coach.

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11 minutes ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

If Murray is under a mandate to make a playoff push from ownership then I blame ownership for being short-sided. Either way, I think that we are going to be in for a couple more seasons of missing the playoffs regardless, so any attempt to juice this team to a first round exit next season is just delaying the inevitable. Which is a rebuild lol. I think you either need give Murray the leeway to do a rebuild or fire him and bring in someone else to do it. Until the last couple of seasons, I think Murray was a suitable GM but he's never had to re-build a team and judging by his comments, he doesn't really want to.

Murray has two more years left on his deal and if the expansion draft weren't coming up, I think he'd be gone if the Ducks don't make the playoffs this season. Plus, I don't think that the Samueli's are going to want to pay for two GM's or two coaches. Things would have to really go off the rails for that to happen, IMO. In two years, I'm betting on the Ducks having a new GM and coach.

I think we'll have a new GM before a new coach (and then after that, who knows) but I think BM will ride out his contract and then "retire" or move to a different position. or just not be a GM and stay VP of operations or whatever. Hell, maybe he'll become the head coach again, I dunno lol

Either way, he's here till AT LEAST the end of the ED regardless of how successful the team is.

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21 hours ago, Jasoaks said:

hmmm...really not sure how much I like that...seems like a misstep in his development to me.... but I dunno! I know Getzlaf broke in as a winger and then pretty quickly went to center. I just get really worried with how we develop players lol Like, if he wants to be center. Is already very good at center. And we need a top center. Why spend ANY time with him somewhere else?

Also, Terry should be center. It's still mind blowing that they haven't put him there, to me.

GMBM puts too much pressure on guys and forces them to play over their heads too early. The examples are numerous. Meanwhile, Getzlaf started on the 4th line. Perry started on the 4th line. Kesler started on the 4th line (he told a funny story on his podcast about how he started on the 4th line with a washed up Trevor Linden on his wing who insisted on taking all of Kesler’s faceoffs). Unless you’ve got a generational talent like Crosby, I don’t see why you would press a guy into a top-6 or top-4 role until he’s been in the league for a season or two. 
I’d like to see Zegras start as the 4C with Grant and Backes on his wings. Let him learn from some savvy vets in a non pressure role before moving him up. Don’t just drop him into a top-6 pressure cooker like they did with Terry last season. It’s too easy to hurt a player’s development that way.

Also, Terry should be a center.

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11 hours ago, Jasoaks said:

I think we'll have a new GM before a new coach (and then after that, who knows) but I think BM will ride out his contract and then "retire" or move to a different position. or just not be a GM and stay VP of operations or whatever. Hell, maybe he'll become the head coach again, I dunno lol

Either way, he's here till AT LEAST the end of the ED regardless of how successful the team is.

Agreed, I can't see BM getting fired before the expansion draft. Then he only has 1 year on his contract after that anyway.

Hopefully the idea is to transition Madden into that position in 2 years.

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On 10/20/2020 at 7:45 AM, BombaysTripleDeke said:

During the hot stove talk with Hayward I’m pretty sure Murray said that they will start Zegras at the wing mostly to break him into the league. Whether he gets Rakell’d or Terry’d is a different story. 

did you see it live, or the edited version on youtube?

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