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Is Eichel a Duck Yet?

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14 minutes ago, tommer-1 said:

I agree on your assessment of Zegras and Drysdale, but McTavish is absolutely at the top of that list, and right behind him is most likely Perreault.  

I know McTavish and Perreault are but my offer wouldn't include those two. My main concern is the Ducks future not the Sabres future...lol. So yeah, I'm throwing a lowball offer but still including a #1 pick for 2023 not for 2022. Also, the Ducks are taking on a lot of risk with Eichel. So as absurd as my offer sounds, the Sabres demands are equally absurd. All in all, the Sabres didn't make a monumental trade to get Eichel and are looking for compensation to get back what they lost. They just sucked in the regular season and got the #2 pick in the draft.

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23 minutes ago, tommer-1 said:

I agree on your assessment of Zegras and Drysdale, but McTavish is absolutely at the top of that list, and right behind him is most likely Perreault.  

Not according to Corey Pronman at the Athletic. The rankings he posted today are: Zegras, Drysdale, McTavish, Comtois, Groulx, Dostal, Zellweger, Colangelo, Lundestrom, Pastujov, Perreault, LaCombe, McLaughlin. https://theathletic.com/2799338/2021/09/01/nhl-pipeline-rankings-no-10-anaheim-ducks-have-difference-makers-coming-up-in-the-system/

His comments on Perreault:

Quote

Perreault had a good season, considering his age in the AHL. He would have good moments, showing his amazing individual skill and creativity. He also had moments where his flaws and age showed, as a 5-foot-11 mediocre skating forward that isn’t overly physical and couldn’t get to the middle of the offensive zone as easily as he could in junior. With his skill, vision and shot, he’s a power-play threat. His three goals were a surprisingly low total, but scouts know he can shoot the puck and it will come. He projects as a bottom six winger.

Maybe we should start including Groulx and Colangelo in our Eichel trade proposals instead of Lundestrom and Perreault... :P

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1 hour ago, perry_mvp said:

In the Ducks case, that could be up to interpretation of the "top two prospects". I would argue that Zegras and Drysdale are full time roster players and wouldn't be on the table. Tracy (top prospect), LaCombe (top prospect) then throw in Axel Andersson, Sam Coangelo and draft pick(s)?

haha i like the way you think about calling them roster players....but I would imagine if you are still capable of having a rookie season...you're probably still a "prospect" in Buffalo's eyes....unfortunately lol

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2 hours ago, Gorbachav55 said:

A couple of interesting things there, but still a lot of questions.  There is no confirmation about which surgery Eichel will be getting - Buffalo could be caving and allowing him to get the surgery he wants, or it could be the other way around.

Buffalo's asking price is still high.  I think this makes sense for them.  It allows them to try to extract as much value from Eichel as possible by letting teams know they're not going to sell low on him.  It also gives them time to potentially convince Eichel that the organization is headed in the right direction and maybe get him to drop his trade demands.  I know reconciliation seems impossible at this point, but we're not privy to the conversations they're having.  In the meantime, if no team is willing to meet the asking price, Buffalo loses very little.  They're clearly tanking this season, with or without Eichel, and the lack of Eichel (or players coming back in an Eichel trade) just makes it more likely they'll be pulling down a top 3 pick next summer.  

The juiciest tidbit was at the bottom when it talked about the change of agents.  It seems like a lot of the impasse might have had to do with Eichel's former agent.  Perhaps he was giving Eichel bad advice and/or dealing with Sabres in a manner that was keeping the situation at loggerheads.  Perhaps with Brisson's "professional[ism]," the Sabres and Eichel can reach an agreement about his surgery, support his rehab, and then convince him to get back on the ice so that other teams can see he's fully healthy before they trade him.  In the best case scenario for Buffalo, they manage to show him over that time that the organization isn't the dumpster fire everyone thinks it is.  I doubt that happens, but even if not, they still get more for their star player.

while I want to keep saying the longer they wait, the less leverage Buffalo has with Eichel....this new info of him getting a surgery and playing again in December does buy Buffalo A LOT more time. At this point, he's probably not being moved till next year. But I still think they need to move him (if he still wants out) before July 1st 2022 otherwise they will have lost SO MUCH leverage with his NMC.

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On 8/27/2021 at 11:25 AM, tommer-1 said:

I think you extend Lindholm, and I think he'll take 7 years at about $7.5 mil to stay in ANA, over better offers.  But, you gotta find that out now. If he wants 8 years or $8 mil or over, you gotta move on at the deadline, imo.

Manson I move ASAP, for almost any return.  Unless he wants to go 3 years at $4 mil or something.  Especially if you are moving on from Lindholm.  You move Lindholm AND Manson and your vets are Fowler and Shattenkirk.  Sub-optimal.

Parayko in at 8 x $6.5M. There's the closest comp for Lindholm. I think that's a good number.

Interesting to note that the Blues now have their three highest paid D-men signed long term at the same cap hit of $6.5M. Faulk (29) is signed until age 35. Krug (30) is signed until 36. Parayko (28) is signed 36. Somehow it doesn't bother me to think that we could have Fowler at $6.5M until age 33 and Lindholm at $6.5M until age 35-36.

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4 minutes ago, dtsdlaw said:

Parayko in at 8 x $6.5M. There's the closest comp for Lindholm. I think that's a good number.

Interesting to note that the Blues now have their three highest paid D-men signed long term at the same cap hit of $6.5M. Faulk (29) is signed until age 35. Krug (30) is signed until 36. Parayko (28) is signed 36. Somehow it doesn't bother me to think that we could have Fowler at $6.5M until age 33 and Lindholm at $6.5M until age 35-36.

Makes Fowler look like underpaid. Poor Fowler.

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13 minutes ago, FanSince1993 said:

Makes Fowler look like underpaid. Poor Fowler.

Or He may want that kind of money?...who knows.

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MooseDuck

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1 hour ago, dtsdlaw said:

Parayko in at 8 x $6.5M. There's the closest comp for Lindholm. I think that's a good number.

Interesting to note that the Blues now have their three highest paid D-men signed long term at the same cap hit of $6.5M. Faulk (29) is signed until age 35. Krug (30) is signed until 36. Parayko (28) is signed 36. Somehow it doesn't bother me to think that we could have Fowler at $6.5M until age 33 and Lindholm at $6.5M until age 35-36.

I would try to sign Lindholm to that contract today. In another two years the Ducks have these NHL guys under contract:

Henrique

Silfverberg

Jones

Fowler

Gibson

 

That's it.

Comtois, Zegras, Terry, and Drysdale are all RFA's in two years, as of now.  They have no other player with NHL experience that is currently on their NHL roster or in the minors under contract for the 2023/2024 season.  They will be looking for bodies the next two seasons.

Edited by tommer-1

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1 hour ago, tommer-1 said:

I would try to sign Lindholm to that contract today. In another two years the Ducks have these NHL guys under contract:

Henrique

Silfverberg

Jones

Fowler

Gibson

 

That's it.

Comtois, Zegras, Terry, and Drysdale are all RFA's in two years, as of now.  They have no other player with NHL experience that is currently on their NHL roster or in the minors under contract for the 2023/2024 season.  They will be looking for bodies the next two seasons.

Well I am just hoping they do something but they are staying the course with "Developing Within" Strategy.

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MooseDuck

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when a team asks for a price no sane person would pay, that means it's all just theater.

also: no.

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15 hours ago, dtsdlaw said:

Not according to Corey Pronman at the Athletic. The rankings he posted today are: Zegras, Drysdale, McTavish, Comtois, Groulx, Dostal, Zellweger, Colangelo, Lundestrom, Pastujov, Perreault, LaCombe, McLaughlin. https://theathletic.com/2799338/2021/09/01/nhl-pipeline-rankings-no-10-anaheim-ducks-have-difference-makers-coming-up-in-the-system/

His comments on Perreault:

Maybe we should start including Groulx and Colangelo in our Eichel trade proposals instead of Lundestrom and Perreault... :P

I don't know why but I don't want to give up Groulx. This is a kid who's good on both ends. I believe he had some sick FO stats in the QMJHL. Not saying he's a future Selke winner but if there's a defensively responsibly center in our near future I think he's the guy. Still early to tell what we have in McTavish but I think having Zegras, McTavish & Groulx down the middle in a couple of years might be something to drool over.

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4 hours ago, DucksFan_08 said:

I don't know why but I don't want to give up Groulx. This is a kid who's good on both ends. I believe he had some sick FO stats in the QMJHL. Not saying he's a future Selke winner but if there's a defensively responsibly center in our near future I think he's the guy. Still early to tell what we have in McTavish but I think having Zegras, McTavish & Groulx down the middle in a couple of years might be something to drool over.

I have watch BO Play and to be honest...Ducks should Keep him in their system...Make sure he earn his mins.

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6 hours ago, DucksFan_08 said:

I don't know why but I don't want to give up Groulx. This is a kid who's good on both ends. I believe he had some sick FO stats in the QMJHL. Not saying he's a future Selke winner but if there's a defensively responsibly center in our near future I think he's the guy. Still early to tell what we have in McTavish but I think having Zegras, McTavish & Groulx down the middle in a couple of years might be something to drool over.

I'm looking forward to seeing him play. I usually get to watch these guys a few times down here in San Diego before they get a call up, but obviously that wasn't the case this past season, so I haven't seen Groulx play yet. I did like reading what Dineen said about him at the end of the season though, and it wouldn't surprise me if the best forward prospects end up being guys that Dineen developed rather than Eakins. 

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2 minutes ago, MissNoSeven said:

Looks like Carter Rowns is off to Detroit.

Good for him!  (And for us.)

2 hours ago, dtsdlaw said:

I'm looking forward to seeing him play. I usually get to watch these guys a few times down here in San Diego before they get a call up, but obviously that wasn't the case this past season, so I haven't seen Groulx play yet. I did like reading what Dineen said about him at the end of the season though, and it wouldn't surprise me if the best forward prospects end up being guys that Dineen developed rather than Eakins. 

This current coaching job Eakins is doing is bad, no doubt, but he also doesn't have much to work with.  The bigger problem is that he doesn't have much to work with because he developed these kids terribly.  I'm hopeful that the latest batch will be a bit better because of Dineen and now Bouchard.

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37 minutes ago, Gorbachav55 said:

This current coaching job Eakins is doing is bad, no doubt, but he also doesn't have much to work with.  The bigger problem is that he doesn't have much to work with because he developed these kids terribly.  I'm hopeful that the latest batch will be a bit better because of Dineen and now Bouchard.

If you're talking about Eakins AHL development keep in mind that guys like Steel and Jones only had 1 season with him and actually had their best numbers. Larsson has been bad in the AHL and NHL. Comtois only played 4 games with the Gulls as Eakins as head coach. Lundestrom only played 12 in San Diego with Eakins. The highest drafted player Eakins ever had was meathead Ritchie. I would say the problem is more from the GM by throwing these kids into the NHL for development. Now, I'm not trying to defend Eakins but Murray hasn't exactly made it an ideal situation either. 

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21 minutes ago, perry_mvp said:

If you're talking about Eakins AHL development keep in mind that guys like Steel and Jones only had 1 season with him and actually had their best numbers. Larsson has been bad in the AHL and NHL. Comtois only played 4 games with the Gulls as Eakins as head coach. Lundestrom only played 12 in San Diego with Eakins. The highest drafted player Eakins ever had was meathead Ritchie. I would say the problem is more from the GM by throwing these kids into the NHL for development. Now, I'm not trying to defend Eakins but Murray hasn't exactly made it an ideal situation either. 

I don't think numbers have anything to do with it.  Eakins' job was to get these guys ready to succeed in the NHL.  He hasn't done that, at either the AHL or NHL level.  Comtois and Kase are the only guys who developed under Eakins who have gone on to live up to or surpass their projections coming out of juniors/college.  It's not all on Eakins - Murray and the player development staff (headed by Marchant) have a lot to do with it as well.  But Steel, Terry, Larsson, Jones, Ritchie, Mahura - Eakins hasn't gotten the most out of these guys.  And some guys, like Pettersson, didn't realize their potential until they got away from the organization.

It's certainly not ALL on Eakins.  But he's not shown himself to be an asset in player development.

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6 minutes ago, Gorbachav55 said:

I don't think numbers have anything to do with it.  Eakins' job was to get these guys ready to succeed in the NHL.  He hasn't done that, at either the AHL or NHL level.  Comtois and Kase are the only guys who developed under Eakins who have gone on to live up to or surpass their projections coming out of juniors/college.  It's not all on Eakins - Murray and the player development staff (headed by Marchant) have a lot to do with it as well.  But Steel, Terry, Larsson, Jones, Ritchie, Mahura - Eakins hasn't gotten the most out of these guys.  And some guys, like Pettersson, didn't realize their potential until they got away from the organization.

It's certainly not ALL on Eakins.  But he's not shown himself to be an asset in player development.

i guess that's one take... but...

Kase - that's your opinion on Kase?  i would not characterize his status as living up or surpassing his projections.  and i'm not sure it's even fair to bring him up with Dallas... it looks like most of his time on the Gulls was concussion recovery time.

Ritchie is also a weird mention.  He hasn't done anything anywhere with anyone, even fricking Boston, that says he has anything more than what he showed here.  i expect his time at Toronto to be... notable, but not for any positive metric reasons.  Some players just don't get better, and if he was going to get there, it would have been with Boston and the TOI he was getting there.

Pettersson - he was doing fine and on the right trajectory while he was here.  if he'd have stayed, and stayed linked up with Lindholm and Rakel, he very well could have done great things here.  that trade was not my favorite act by BM, but there's no mark against Eakins here.

Steel, Terry, Jones - i mean, come on, they had their best seasons in the NHL under Eakins last season.  i don't know what you're looking for.

Mahura - we need him off the taxi squad and playing regularly.  i still have high hopes.  another thing not on Eakins.

Larsson - i put him in the same boat as Ritchie - some players just don't get better.

like i've said earlier in this thread - the ducks have an absolute village of coaching and development to throw at the youngers this season, and this kind of approach has been needed for a long time, under multiple coaches, just to be even keel with what other teams in a rebuild do, especially while not having the player roster to do the development on-ice.  last season was about getting them playing time and getting the players to buy into the system, by hook or crook.  this season looks like it's going to be focused individual and line development with no room for excuses for players or staff if the performance isn't there. 

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32 minutes ago, Fisix said:

i guess that's one take... but...

Kase - that's your opinion on Kase?  i would not characterize his status as living up or surpassing his projections.  and i'm not sure it's even fair to bring him up with Dallas... it looks like most of his time on the Gulls was concussion recovery time.

Ritchie is also a weird mention.  He hasn't done anything anywhere with anyone, even fricking Boston, that says he has anything more than what he showed here.  i expect his time at Toronto to be... notable, but not for any positive metric reasons.  Some players just don't get better, and if he was going to get there, it would have been with Boston and the TOI he was getting there.

Pettersson - he was doing fine and on the right trajectory while he was here.  if he'd have stayed, and stayed linked up with Lindholm and Rakel, he very well could have done great things here.  that trade was not my favorite act by BM, but there's no mark against Eakins here.

Steel, Terry, Jones - i mean, come on, they had their best seasons in the NHL under Eakins last season.  i don't know what you're looking for.

Mahura - we need him off the taxi squad and playing regularly.  i still have high hopes.  another thing not on Eakins.

Larsson - i put him in the same boat as Ritchie - some players just don't get better.

like i've said earlier in this thread - the ducks have an absolute village of coaching and development to throw at the youngers this season, and this kind of approach has been needed for a long time, under multiple coaches, just to be even keel with what other teams in a rebuild do, especially while not having the player roster to do the development on-ice.  last season was about getting them playing time and getting the players to buy into the system, by hook or crook.  this season looks like it's going to be focused individual and line development with no room for excuses for players or staff if the performance isn't there. 

Steel's most productive NHL season was his first 22 games with Bob Murray behind the bench. He's been terrible since Eakins took over as HC and put him in situations he was not ready for at the NHL level. Last season was actually his worst of all of them.

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2 hours ago, Gorbachav55 said:

I don't think numbers have anything to do with it.  Eakins' job was to get these guys ready to succeed in the NHL.  He hasn't done that, at either the AHL or NHL level.  Comtois and Kase are the only guys who developed under Eakins who have gone on to live up to or surpass their projections coming out of juniors/college.  It's not all on Eakins - Murray and the player development staff (headed by Marchant) have a lot to do with it as well.  But Steel, Terry, Larsson, Jones, Ritchie, Mahura - Eakins hasn't gotten the most out of these guys.  And some guys, like Pettersson, didn't realize their potential until they got away from the organization.

It's certainly not ALL on Eakins.  But he's not shown himself to be an asset in player development.

Shouldn't they be getting their development at the AHL level? I mean, that's why we have an AHL affiliate, for player development. Murray's "rebuild" or "re-tool" was to bring in under developed assets because he couldn't make or didn't want to make any off season moves to buy time for the kids. He should have started this after Carlyle's 2nd season back when the Ducks got bounced in the 1st round. So from my point of view, it's been one blunder after another from Bob. He promotes under developed players to play for an AHL coach at the NHL level and wonders why the team is awful. I'll throw blame on Eakins for accepting the Ducks HC job when he clearly wasn't ready for it. But again, it's also on BM for not hiring an experienced NHL coach.

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10 hours ago, dtsdlaw said:

Steel's most productive NHL season was his first 22 games with Bob Murray behind the bench. He's been terrible since Eakins took over as HC and put him in situations he was not ready for at the NHL level. Last season was actually his worst of all of them.

admitted.

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If anyone listens to The Athletic Hockey Show podcast (available through Spotify without a subscription), Sean McIndoe talks a little bit about the Eichel situation in the episode that came out yesterday.  His thoughts track along with what I've been thinking as far as Buffalo's strategy.  Buffalo isn't getting the offer they want (nowhere close, although a lot of that is on them for putting the price so high), so they're simply waiting it out until they can get Eichel back on the ice, showcase him for other teams, and then trade him either at the deadline or after the season before his NTC kicks in.

Obviously the biggest hurdle is figuring out how to get past the injury treatment impasse.

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18 hours ago, dtsdlaw said:

Steel's most productive NHL season was his first 22 games with Bob Murray behind the bench. He's been terrible since Eakins took over as HC and put him in situations he was not ready for at the NHL level. Last season was actually his worst of all of them.

Which was especially disappointing considering I thought he was one of our best players through the first 10-12 games. Then he completely fell off a cliff.

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*Looks at Watch* I think we can all agree Ducks Getting Jack is now a mute point...No need to get involve into Drama. Let's focus on Ducks Youth Movement.

DuckPride 4ever

MooseDuck

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9 hours ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:

Well, talk about things getting worse for Eichel. Reports now that he’ll miss the Olympics. Huge blow to Team USA also. This may have just gift wrapped another gold to Canada.

Guess So and Probaly another reason imho Ducks should just not bother with getting Jack...It's going to get worse Bombay.

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MooseDuck

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Eichel loses the C….failed a physical and they took it away. Either he is not working out at all OR he can’t work out because of his neck, so he failed and they took it away anyway. Salt in an open wound…geez

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1 hour ago, ike8228 said:

Eichel loses the C….failed a physical and they took it away. Either he is not working out at all OR he can’t work out because of his neck, so he failed and they took it away anyway. Salt in an open wound…geez

Eichel met with the  Sabre's GM two days ago. I'm  speculating he was given an ultimatum to proceed with the spinal fusion surgery. He's sticking to his guns and  decisions have consequences. Odds are better than not he's played his ;last game as a Buffalo Sabre.

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